Which CPS

[rammertide07]

My dad took his trick imto Ford to have the ICP replaced. While he was in there, they did the recall on the cps. Now he says the truck runs like crap and his milage has dropped off. I'm banking on the cps. I went through 2 grey ones before I bought a black one from riffraff, now everyone is out of the black cps's. I've been researching on which cps to get but I've read so many part #s and "this one is better"...now I'm confused. His truck is stock 01 F250. But right now he has it at a local diesel shop (the mechanic is a Ford dealer diesel tech) and he is going to check out the reason for bad performance and add an Edge tuner (up to 75hp)and gauges. I'd like to know what would be the best option to put in for the cps. I'd also like to know for myself so I can replace my grey spare. Thanks

[cleatus12r]

The pink ones are the best.

If anyone really thinks that there is much of a difference, I'll be the first to disagree.
I've had them all for varying lengths of time (never had a failure though) and NEVER had anything change from one to the next.

[rammertide07]

I wish I was as fortunate as you. But like I've said, I went through 2 grey cps's in 1 year. I did not have any problems with my truck until Ford swapped the cps on me when i took it in for a leaky fuel bowl valve. If there is not that much of a difference in the cps's then what was the point in the recall? Only thing I can think of is that perhaps the 02-03 trucks might have had a problem and they did the recall for 99-03. I know the magnet in the black cps is a lot stronger than the magnet in the grey cps.

[cleatus12r]

If there is not that much of a difference in the cps's then what was the point in the recall?

The trucks would die while driving. As we've found, this happens with ANY of the camshaft position sensors in use today regardless of color. However, since so many people were having trouble with the 7.3L stalling while driving, Ford made an effort to quell the anger of the customer by replacing the sensors free of charge. The color is simply there to give an at-a-glance identifier of the most recent iteration.

[rammertide07]

Well I wish they still offered the black cps. I don't care if it was pink, just as long as the insides were the same. While I know it will give out one day, it has a better track record with me (and what seems many other SD owners) of not causing the truck to cut out going down the road and completely giving out.

[907DAVE]

I had bought into the "blue" CPS hype a few years back. After learning they might have an effect on timing I threw it into the glove box as a spare. When the original CPS started going out on the dually I replaced it with the blue sensor. 3 months later the new blue sensor went out, now I am rockin the recall grey sensor, and have not noticed anything different.

[rammertide07]

Yea, I dont like the idea of running the blue cps (I think its for the DT466). I saw a video of a guy on youtube that posted a video of his truck ideling with that cps and it sounded sick, like the timing was off. I think bad timing mixed with tuning would be a bad thing. I've been looking for the International version for the DT444, but there seems to be 2 different part #'s. I was doing most of the research on my phone which can be a headache at times. Now I'm back on the PC so gonna do some more digging. If all else fells, I have a lightly used grey CPS in the glove box.

[rammertide07]

Ok, I found a source of the original black one. If it truely is the right one, I'm going to buy more. It's the same part # of the one I got from RiffRaff. Thanks for ya'lls input.

[blue72]

Ok, I found a source of the original black one. If it truely is the right one, I'm going to buy more. It's the same part # of the one I got from RiffRaff. Thanks for ya'lls input.

So did you get some?

[rammertide07]

Here's a recent post on TDS, I think this is well explained. I may just be a grey cps hatred like guys that have had bad luck with Ford trucks are Ford haters.

What type of CPS Cam Position Sensor do you have?

The old, original Black units are the best, the International
1825899C93 that were manufactured around 2000 to 2003.

The new Ford/IH Gray or blue units suck, they have about 1/8"
of plastic covering the hall sensor and they are not centered,
they are off-center almost 1/8" throwing the timing way off
giving high EGT's and poor fuel economy.

Here is a new IH Blue CPS, I cut the end plastic off that was 1/8" thick
and put silicone around the sensor. Notice how the sensor is off set?

Here is a photo of a Borg Warner CPS that has a much better hall sensor,
USA made and it's centered. I cut them all open to inspect what type each
sensor uses and if they were centered or off-set.


Here is the old stock "the best" CPS from 2000 NOS stock, notice the sensor is centered and there is no plastic covering the sensor.



Here is a pic of a CPS 'Air Gap' instrument, it measures the gap.
Some engines need to be shimmed the 466 for instance, and even the
7.3L works better with 1 or 2 shims sometimes. Depends on the type of
CPS you are using. If you don't have this 300.00+ instrument you can simply
add a single shim to your CPS and see how it runs. You may or may not notice a difference without software ie: AutoEnginuity. My Van seems to be dialed-in using one shim with an old, original Black CPS.


Here is a pic of how many CPS I tested and cut open.

The CPS is specified at about 18#s ft. torque to install it.

This is the one most sensitive, important parts of the vehicle
that will either make it run like a vette or a ****box.


When you look at this pic notice the cam sensor counts the teeth
as the wheel spins, it counts the smallest tooth between 5-6 (It's so small you cannot write on it) and the largest
tooth at 11 and this thing is spinning like crazy. This is responsible for the timing, fuel delivery, amount of fuel etc. So the new CPS that have the 1/8" of plastic covering the hall sensor are already at a disadvantage. The CPS has a magnetic hall sensor and it counts the teeth. It needs to count them perfectly.

On the old, original Black CPS the magnetic hall sensor has such a strong magnet you can pick up small metal objects with it, like a small key, or large nail clippers etc. I noticed the stronger the magnetic signal, the better the CPS can count the teeth correctly thus giving you optimum performance.

the new Blue or gray CPS from Ford/IH have such a weak magnetic strength due to the 1/8" plastic covering the sensor and the fact the sensor is off-set from center, it's wasting so much fuel and causing high EGT's.



To sum it up,

If you have one of the new CPS units in your truck, try to either get a new Borg Warner black unit or an old International 1825899C93.

When you call IH to get this part#, it will refer you to the new CPS
that is the poor design. You will need to get an old stock unit.

And the Borg Warner BWD unit only has about 1/32" of thin plastic
covering the end cap on the hall sensor and it's only blocking the signal a little bit. But you can still cut the end off with a dremmil tool like I did to expose the hall sensor and the unit will work 100% this way as nothing is blocking the magnetic hall sensor itself.

I tried to explain this in easy way, but it's much more complex.

The CPS is really the brain & heart of the truck put together.


I tried over 15 CPS units in my van, and I found one old stock unit
that had the best magnetic strength and it made the van run great.
I get 18-20 on a 80HP tune at 67 mph 1886 rpm or about.



Sent from my ADR6300 using Tapatalk

[A/Ox4]

Yesterday while doing some reading I saw a guy who tested 15+ CPS models. He said the best results (other than factory black CPS) were a CPS from Borg Warner.

I looked it up. It costs $25 and can be had from o'reilly's. Today I picked one up and swapped it for my CPS.
Once I verified that mine was a grey started the swap. I wasnt going to touch it if it was black.

The BW CPS was noticeably larger than the grey OEM one. So much so that I wasnt sure it would fit! But it fit perfectly.

Got the BW in and it was an IMMEDIATE difference. The idle is much smoother now. Before it was inconsistent, about 100-200 variation in idle speed. Not much, just enough to be noticeable. That seems to be all gone now. This new CPS only went in today, so I will be on the look out for changes in the truck, but so far I am pleased! The grey is in the glove box along with a 10mm ratchet just in case.

I will report back in a few days with more results.

[rammertide07]

I got 2 BW CPS's from an online parts store that had them listed as same part as the black CPS (International P/N). Even in the picture they were black. I got them in and they were grey:matt-roloff: I felt the magnetic strength of the sensor and it wasn't even half as strong as the black CPS. I could pick up one end of a wrench with the black CPS. I still have them in the glove box as spares. Everyone is out of new black CPS's, RiffRaff has some used black CPS's for $10 shipped.

[cj45lc]

What is the part # of the BW CPS

Can't beat that price

[rammertide07]

Sorry, it was a Wells CPS I found thinking it was the equivalant of the black CPS.

Wells Camshaft Position Sensor SU2159 (http://www.mypartsgarage.com/wells-wells-engine-management-engine-4882.html)

Borg Warner CPS! - Ford Truck Enthusiasts Forums (http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1139228-borg-warner-cps.html)

...how many forums you onA/Ox4

[A/Ox4]

What is the part # of the BW CPS

Can't beat that price

CSS1603


...how many forums you onA/Ox4

Quite a few... :howdy:

But I dont participate in active conversations in most of them, just scan for ways I can help or learn new things.