Building an engine run stand.

[cleatus12r]

This will be an ongoing thread for the next couple of weekends as I am tired of starting these things almost literally on the floor. My dad made a cart at the beginning of recorded history and I decided to build a new one out of some scrap around the shop from other projects. I'll attach pictures as I take them and load them. The first batch should be tonight and then I'll have a few more hours in it tomorrow. His works but it's no more than a small wheeled cart which has two angled perches that the engine just sits on with a flat spot for the bellhousing to rest. No radiator attachment, no gauges, etc.

The initial build is for a 390 and then I'll build mounts for a hot little 351W I'll be putting together for a friend's derby car.

[cleatus12r]

Here are a couple pictures of this weekend's progress. I've gotten to a stopping point without gauges, fuel cell, and motivation.
:crazy:

I have an MSD 6A and coil as well as a 2V Holley Pro-Jection that I've had since 1998 that will go on this as a permanent fixture. Not that I really need that stuff on here, but it's doing as much good sitting on a shelf in the shop as it would do on this stand.

[Power Hungry]

Pretty nice looking.

Suggestion... I'd make the back end height adjustable. Sleeved box with set bolt. That also would allow for different bellhousing/mounting options by making a new upper section. This also helps when setting the angle of the engine so that the carb is level.

I'm sure you going to put some large casters on it. It's nice to be able to roll that sucker out of the way.

Here's a couple videos of the 289 on the Easy Run engine stand. After looking at what all the materials and components would cost, I decided it would just be easier to buy one that to build one from scratch. As much fun as it is to fabricate stuff, it really comes down to available time to actually get anything accomplished.

Anyway, enjoy.

1) tE7lokNDfhE 2) Tl4fN7SOcgU

3) 7kpMYTT9mso 4) 4tHjpLbq8V8

[cleatus12r]

I've watched your videos numerous times. Do you still have that engine?

I thought about buying a pre-made stand but.....well.....$$$$ really didn't trump my time and spare metal. :cheesy smile: Also, Fords need a bellhousing attached anyway for starter mounting and this will just run Fords so the bellhousing to transmission bolts will always be in the same spot (again, just stuff laying around - bellhousings galore around here) so I figured I'd only need the adjustable engine mount perches.

I have a fuel cell coming and a few gauges on the way.


Yes, big casters on the way too. I only have it on stands right now so I can work comfortably at chest height.

I'm into it a day and a half and about $210 so far not counting the scrap metal and 22 year old ignition/fuel injection parts.

[Power Hungry]

I've watched your videos numerous times. Do you still have that engine?

I thought about buying a pre-made stand but.....well.....$$$$ really didn't trump my time and spare metal. :cheesy smile: Also, Fords need a bellhousing attached anyway for starter mounting and this will just run Fords so the bellhousing to transmission bolts will always be in the same spot (again, just stuff laying around - bellhousings galore around here) so I figured I'd only need the adjustable engine mount perches.

I have a fuel cell coming and a few gauges on the way.


Yes, big casters on the way too. I only have it on stands right now so I can work comfortably at chest height.

I'm into it a day and a half and about $210 so far not counting the scrap metal and 22 year old ignition/fuel injection parts.

Yeah, that's where it's handing having a scrap pile to pull from. I don't really have that luxury, so I'd end up with a fortune just in steel alone.

To answer your question, yes... I still have that engine. It's supposed to go into the Fairlane, but I have so little time to play with the car. I'm kinda looking for roller that's in a little better shape than the one I have. There's enough stuff to choose from around here, but I'm pretty picky and haven't found just the right deal.

I'd put it in the Bronco, but a 289 just isn't going to be torquey enough to really get it going and I know I won't be happy with it. Something smaller and lighter would be a good fit for the 289. Another Fairlane that isn't quite so rusted out, or maybe a Falcon. I'm not super big on Mustangs, and they're pricey as hell as it is. Out there somewhere, I'm sure there's just the ticket for me.

Anyway, interested in watching this project come along. :thumbsup:

[cleatus12r]

Yeah, that's where it's handing having a scrap pile to pull from. I don't really have that luxury, so I'd end up with a fortune just in steel alone.

To answer your question, yes... I still have that engine. It's supposed to go into the Fairlane, but I have so little time to play with the car. I'm kinda looking for roller that's in a little better shape than the one I have. There's enough stuff to choose from around here, but I'm pretty picky and haven't found just the right deal.

I'd put it in the Bronco, but a 289 just isn't going to be torquey enough to really get it going and I know I won't be happy with it. Something smaller and lighter would be a good fit for the 289. Another Fairlane that isn't quite so rusted out, or maybe a Falcon. I'm not super big on Mustangs, and they're pricey as hell as it is. Out there somewhere, I'm sure there's just the ticket for me.

Anyway, interested in watching this project come along. :thumbsup:

I've always thought that the small blocks would be perfect for a Ranger or Pinto. The bigger cars and pickups need a little more than a short stroke V8 to feel like they have ample oomph. Mustangs aren't my cup-o-tea either. My ex had a 72 Torino GT and I always loved that car....I guess I'm into the full frame stuff. It was a 351C car (never been a 335 series fan) so I had plans for a 429 and we know how that worked out. Want a Crown Vic? :cheesy smile:



I guess I've always been spoiled with just "having stuff laying around". I get my parts-hoarding tendencies from my dad and a lot of the stuff here is from trading/labor on things he and I have worked on over the years. I also have room for it and don't have to pay for storage so that helps.

[cleatus12r]

I got the 3 gallon fuel tank mounted which also came with stainless braided line and AN fittings. I just knew there was a reason I never used that line or those fittings. What a pain in the butt. They're on there for good though.

Anyway, the supply line is done, the pump is mounted, the filter is mounted, and the return line is a 3/8-5/16 barb adapter away from being done.

The radiator hoses are also done. Well, the FE ones anyway since every other engine family will take a different set of hoses. The upper radiator hose is a lower 99-03 7.3L lower hose with four inches cut off of one end. Funny how that works out. :happy-dancing:

[cleatus12r]

A few vidyas! Cell phone camera quality recordings!

https://rumble.com/embed/vc0bd9/?pub=ddz3b

https://rumble.com/embed/vc0a35/?pub=ddz3b

https://rumble.com/embed/vc092h/?pub=ddz3b

[Power Hungry]

Very cool! Engine sounds nice, too. :2thumbs:

[cleatus12r]

That one took about an hour to remove and strip down to a bare long block (intake, rocker shafts, oil pump and tin off of it), bolt to an engine stand, and stuff into a couple of heavy duty plastic bags ready to be locked away in a shed until needed.

I have a 400 here in the shed that's supposed to be a fairly low mileage reman. although any 335-series engine with more than about 20K miles needs a rod and main tune-up anyway so it'll likely get that stuff, put on this run stand, and then sold as I already have a guy interested in it (79 Bronco owner). I have no use for any 351C/M/400 but 390's can sit around here forever as I feel they're worth their weight in gold.

That engine will likely be the next run stand victim so stay tuned. It was swapped for a 460 quite a few years ago but should still run alright and make a good candidate for the Bronco owner as his 351M has over 200K on it (his father in law bought it new) and the current owner is quite sure it's never even had a valve cover off of it. That's weird to me. It's impossible to find a 335-series that hasn't developed at least a couple burned exhaust valves after 100K and never had rod and main bearings replaced since most have zero oil pressure after 60K miles (although they still run a long time with that issue).

[Power Hungry]

The heads on those 335 series suck. Have had to deal with stuck valves because idiots in the the machine shops don't know how much clearance the valves need in the guides due to poor coolant circulation through the heads. I don't the van drove more then 30 miles before the valves would seize. Thank goodness it was a low compression engine and the valves stuck just out of reach of the pistons. :whistle1:

It's especially fun when you have to pull the heads 3 times (including the original pull) in a damn E-Series. By the third time, all the emissions stuff had been ghosted. I guess the only real advantage of a 335 C/M series is that there are no coolant passages in the intake manifold, so they are a breeze to yank. Heads are heavy as crap, though.

Ah, the days of doing actual wrench work. :crazy:

Can't wait for the next build!

[cleatus12r]

The next victim.

It took about 45 minutes to make engine mounts and get this turd bolted on.

[cleatus12r]

Had it running a few times over the last couple of days. It was finally nice enough to degrease it and clean all of the pigeon poop off of it.

Why is it that stock cams and exhaust manifolds make an engine sound so crappy? :hehe:

https://rumble.com/vf2tdb-400-ford-on-run-stand.html

[cleatus12r]

I put that 400 on Craigslist and sold it for $700 in less than a day.

:2thumbs:

[Power Hungry]

Since we're on the subject, you don't have any extra 385 or FE engines you'd want to part with, do you? I want to build something for the Bronco and while I have a 335 I can build into a 400, I'd rather just have something better to start with.

Let me know.

[cleatus12r]

Since we're on the subject, you don't have any extra 385 or FE engines you'd want to part with, do you? I want to build something for the Bronco and while I have a 335 I can build into a 400, I'd rather just have something better to start with.

Let me know.

You know that shipping will cost an arm and a leg....maybe both arms. Who knows?

I have three good rebuildable (i.e. "running when pulled") FEs, two 390s and one 360. I have a 352 that needs a total overhaul, and then this last rebuilt 390 (from the video) but I'm not sure if I want to let that one go.

As far as 385 series stuff, I have a later tall deck block, with a '79 crank (with counterweight and weighted flywheel - no proper flexplate), a 460 short block that needs standard machine work, two complete mid-70's "running when pulled" but no clue as to any problems, and a '68 429 4V...but that one isn't for sale.

My curiosity has been piqued about building a 430+ inch 335 series with 10.0:1 but then a person has to fix all of the oiling issues and find heads - I hear Edelbrock makes a set of aluminum ones.

Again, I'm not sure how much freight would be on any of this stuff....probably way more than anything you could just find locally.

[Power Hungry]

The problem around here is that any of the old iron gets bought up pretty quickly. Anything from the '60s and '70s is pretty difficult to find, and they want an arm and leg for it when you can find something.

A buildable late '60s FE or 429 would be an ideal score. I'll just keep poking around. If all else fails, there's always this option...

https://bearblockmotors.com/

Aluminum FE blocks and heads! Just a tad on the pricey side, though. But at least it's a true side-oiler setup. :D

[cleatus12r]

Next victim.

1968 429 that has been in the shed for a number of years.

[Power Hungry]

Oooo That's gonna be a fun one! :D

[cleatus12r]

Well for as long as it's been sitting (in a building but not covered) on its side with no spark plugs in it......

The heads are coming off first just to see if the cylinders are able to be run as-is. There was a rag stuffed in the intake, but it's long since deteriorated to dust so I'm sure there's been a mouse home or two in there. The oil that came out of the pan looked great though......:whistle1:

Dad and I dismantled a 74 F100 this Sunday too. Married C6/205 behind a 3.5" stroke FE of some sort. C4 head on one side, C8 on the other, and a C6 casting on the block. Either it's a 352 or someone wasted their time putting different heads and a 4V intake on a 360; not that there's any difference in 95% of the FE "low-perf" heads' valves or combustion chamber sizes so I'm not too concerned about the heads. Besides emission controls and hardened seats, they're all the same. I'm not pulling the pan to look at piston skirts or heads to measure the bore.

[cleatus12r]

Oooo That's gonna be a fun one! :D

Thinking I might get it torn down this week. I've got a bit of off-time scheduled so I'd like to get a look inside.

I picked up an 89 F350 crewcab a few months ago with a "ran-when-parked" 460 that had an incorrectly installed front main and pan seal. Unknown miles but I didn't like all of the sludge and crud in the lower part of the engine when I had the pan off (as in it's a poster-child for the world of poor maintenance practices). Besides, the longer I stare at the EFI 460, the more I think that I don't want a boring 460 that can't handle a different cam or any major performance pieces due to the speed density system...and the best time to do the work is right now with the engine already out.

I'd miss the ease of starting, but low 200s horsepower will suck!

[cleatus12r]

Nothing like having a brand new engine come apart.

Tore down the C8xx head and block engine today. It's a 460. It looks like it never made it through its first oil change. This should demonstrate the importance of correct/large enough ring gaps.

Two of the cylinders will be perfect after a light hone and the rest will just get a crosshatch pattern. There is ZERO ridge. I'll buy a set of new pistons, some gaskets, and probably have it balanced. Then throw it back together and run it.

[cleatus12r]

I spent some time today getting parts ready for the machine shop. Pistons are on the way along with headers and a cam.

Suppose .017" of ring gap might be not-quite-enough? :doh: Like most things I have here, if it was a good runner, it wouldn't be in the shed for my entertainment pleasure.

[cleatus12r]

Pistons and cam on the way.

Did a bunch of math and typing into Desktop Dyno and settled on a cam that will keep the BMEP happy (similar to stock but carry it past 2000 RPM) and make power past 4500 RPM if desired all while losing nothing down low. I also have to keep the torque at bay since the 5-speed input torque rating is already being pushed by the stock 460.

I had to be picky with cam selection as this is a 10.5:1 engine and going "too small" or stock on a cam would really keep my dynamic compression in that 8.9-9.1 range and that's too much for pump gas.

Anyhoo, once the pistons show up it's off to the machine shop and balancer.

[Power Hungry]

I spent some time today getting parts ready for the machine shop. Pistons are on the way along with headers and a cam.

Suppose .017" of ring gap might be not-quite-enough? :doh: Like most things I have here, if it was a good runner, it wouldn't be in the shed for my entertainment pleasure.

What did you end up running for Ring End Gap? Normally on a 4.360" bore with factory pistons and rings, I'd use about .025" - 0.028" for compression rings (maybe 0.028" - 0.030" on the 2nd ring) and .018" - 0.020" for oil ring.

For aftermarket stuff I just use whatever they recommend, especially for hypereutectic pistons. The expansion rate on those are slightly different then regular aluminum slugs.

*Technically", some specs only call for 0.004" per bore inch, so in those cases a 0.017" end gap would be considered acceptable. At the end of the day, I'd rather be a tad larger gap than too small. As someone mentioned:

If the gap is too big, only you will know. If the gap is too large, EVERYONE will know! :hehe:

[cleatus12r]

What did you end up running for Ring End Gap? Normally on a 4.360" bore with factory pistons and rings, I'd use about .025" - 0.028" for compression rings (maybe 0.028" - 0.030" on the 2nd ring) and .018" - 0.020" for oil ring.

For aftermarket stuff I just use whatever they recommend, especially for hypereutectic pistons. The expansion rate on those are slightly different then regular aluminum slugs.

*Technically", some specs only call for 0.004" per bore inch, so in those cases a 0.017" end gap would be considered acceptable. At the end of the day, I'd rather be a tad larger gap than too small. As someone mentioned:

If the gap is too big, only you will know. If the gap is too large, EVERYONE will know! :hehe:


I'll be running .029" due to the 4.442" bore and the formula of .0065"/in. on run of the mill "rebuilder" cast pistons.

Better safe than sorry.

[cleatus12r]

Everything is heading off to the balancer's shop on Monday afternoon. Here's a bit of trivia for you, too. I was a bit worried about what I was going to do about a flywheel. I've seen a few and done one with a 360/390 flywheel and FE starter but don't really want a Frankenstein just in case I ever sell it since it's not fair to the next guy.

Ford didn't put a manual in the F-Series/460 combo until '83-ish and by that time (since '79), all 460s were externally balanced. The harmonic dampers are all the same from '68-'97 so the crank spacers are where the difference lies. No problems there. The early flywheels (429 manual) are not the right size to use with the ZF 5-speed bellhousing so what's a guy to do? Buy the correct '89 460 flywheel and machine the cast-in counterweight off!

I bought a Pioneer flywheel from Scummit and while it is new-in-the-box, somebody must have gotten a little ways into a similar project and returned it...the counterweight had already been milled off.....I would have used a lathe, but hey, it saved a few bucks! I let a Scummit rep know that their returns department needs to be a little more particular since somebody with an ACTUAL '79-later rotating assembly may have gotten it and installed it....then chased a vibration afterward.

[cleatus12r]

Headers are supposed to be here today!

I'll have this thing running this afternoon....fingers crossed! So long as the cam survives break-in, I am SOOOOO excited to hear this thing run. Cam specs are pretty wild.

[Power Hungry]

Headers are supposed to be here today!

I'll have this thing running this afternoon....fingers crossed! So long as the cam survives break-in, I am SOOOOO excited to hear this thing run. Cam specs are pretty wild.

Always irritated me having to put a bellhousing on the engines to start them.

That aside, very exciting! Let us know how it goes. :2thumbs:

[cleatus12r]

First startup.

https://rumble.com/v1blpnp-breaking-in-and-burning-off-header-paint..html


After running a while.

https://rumble.com/v1blrxx-after-break-in.-1100-rpm.-cell-phone-camera-quality..html

[Power Hungry]

First startup.

https://rumble.com/v1blpnp-breaking-in-and-burning-off-header-paint..html


After running a while.

https://rumble.com/v1blrxx-after-break-in.-1100-rpm.-cell-phone-camera-quality..html

Sounds lumpy! Gonna be great in that buggy. :2thumbs:

[cleatus12r]

That's the 460 going (is in but not yet running) into my '89 F350 for a winter pickup. I'll be making the wiring harness for the Duraspark distributor to GM HEI module and E-CORE coil tonight.

The 360 thing with 340 pistons for the buggy is in the works....taking the pistons to the machine shop tomorrow so the block can get bored and the wrist pin bushings can be installed/sized.

[Power Hungry]

That's the 460 going (is in but not yet running) into my '89 F350 for a winter pickup. I'll be making the wiring harness for the Duraspark distributor to GM HEI module and E-CORE coil tonight.

The 360 thing with 340 pistons for the buggy is in the works....taking the pistons to the machine shop tomorrow so the block can get bored and the wrist pin bushings can be installed/sized.

Oh, my bad. Got the engines confused. I guess if I'd looked hard enough, I'd have realized that was a 385 block, not an FE. :doh: I was too busy enjoying the sound.

[cleatus12r]

I got the engine installed last Wednesday but I wanted to get the exhaust built, rear axle swapped (disc brakes from the blue/white 1995 before I put the SuperDuty axles in it), and clean out the interior and put in a few new parts like pedal pads, shifter boots, etc.

The reason it's "the winter pickup" is because it's originally from Illinois so the body's already got some rot on it. I have all of these diesel pickups (with zero rust) that I don't like to or want to use when it's below zero and the roads are slathered in deicer. I decided I needed a "gasser" for that and I don't have to care about rust.

Original purchase price of $1400 with a ran-when-parked EFI 460 and a lot of non-maintenance for 190K miles. It should have about double the HP now. I'm into this thing about $2800 and by the time winter rolls around and I figure out what to do with tires/wheels, I'll be a shade over $3K if I buy some and don't use something I have laying around. I have a set of 2019 18" wheels but $500 for adapters is a bit rich for my blood....and I don't have any 18" tires in the shed.

https://rumble.com/v1d9ziz-in-and-running.-waiting-for-winter-now..html

[cleatus12r]

Got the call from the balancer today. Gonna head to Billings today and go get the HP360 parts.

That sounds so wrong....just like "Performance 400"