Gryphon on a 7.3L

[travisunderwood]

Originally Posted by Power Hungry

Please see the above highlights. I hope these help answer your questions. Let me know if there's anything else you need answers to.

Take care and happy New Year.

Thanks!

If you can run the same programming on the gryphon and the chip with the same performance gains, what are the impacts of the negative base codes?

It appears that in my scenario the gryphon would be a good option as long as I don't want to switch on the fly. Which I am willing to accept.

If I purchase the gryphon with custom tunes, can I switch to other tunes without additional cost nor sending the gryphon in as long as they are not custom?

How to choose between 65 and 80 daily tunes and which towing?

There is all this talk about Tony Wildman on the powerstroke forums. Of course this is the PHP forum. Bill - would you say your tunes are on par and just as trusted as the TW tunes?

I just need to decided between the Phoenix or the Gryphon and I am still no clear what is best for me. Seems both will do the trick and the Gryphon has the gauges and other features for simplicity.

Thanks again

[Power Hungry]

Originally Posted by travisunderwood

Thanks!

If you can run the same programming on the gryphon and the chip with the same performance gains, what are the impacts of the negative base codes?

Mostly shifting issues. There are some strategies that tend to have better shifting characteristics.

It appears that in my scenario the gryphon would be a good option as long as I don't want to switch on the fly. Which I am willing to accept.

No problem.

If I purchase the gryphon with custom tunes, can I switch to other tunes without additional cost nor sending the gryphon in as long as they are not custom?

Correct, to an Extent. You can choose from any of the basic calibrations and change your configuration 2 times without charge. After that, it is $30.00 to change the configuration to cover the time it takes to compile the fileset and load it on the server.

How to choose between 65 and 80 daily tunes and which towing?

• 25hp Extremely Heavy: Tow 12,500+ pounds
• 40hp Heavy Tow: 10,000 - 12,500 pounds
• 65hp Moderate Tow: 7,500 - 10,000 pounds
• 80hp Light Tow: Up to 7,500 pounds
• 65hp Daily Driver - Good economy and performance for city and highway driving
• 80hp Daily Driver - Little bit more aggressive than the 65 Daily Driver.

There is all this talk about Tony Wildman on the powerstroke forums. Of course this is the PHP forum. Bill - would you say your tunes are on par and just as trusted as the TW tunes?

First, let me say that this may be a "PHP" run forum, but we have no problem answering questions pertaining to other vendors or their products. We have a good relationship with many of the vendors and tuners out there and we would help a Bully Dog or SCT customer just as quickly as we would our own customers. This forum is all about helping the performance community, not about finding ways to stuff dollars in our pocket or making other products look bad.

I don't have any question that our tuning is just as good as Tony's, and I know Tony would say the same thing. Tony is a great tuner (and a great guy ) and you would be just as happy running his setup as you would be running ours.

I will add (and this is in no way meant as disrespect towards Tony or any other tuner) that we've been tuning the 7.3L for over a dozen years and most of the tuners out there have learned their tuning from me, either directly (through training and/or assistance) or indirectly (through the copying of calibrations I've developed as far back as when I worked for Superchips). Most tuners have gone on to develop their own tuning styles and this is why sometimes one tuner is able to better fit the needs of a customer than another tuner. It doesn't make any particular tuner better than another, just a more compatible fit.

I just need to decided between the Phoenix or the Gryphon and I am still no clear what is best for me. Seems both will do the trick and the Gryphon has the gauges and other features for simplicity.

If switch on the fly is not a primary concern, the Gryphon offers more flexibility and features at an extremely reasonable price. The Phoenix offers more positions, but you'll need additional equipment if you want gauges and/or diagnostics capabilities and this will run the total costs up considerably.

Thanks again

I hope the above answers help. It's often a hard choice to make between the Gryphon and the Phoenix, but ultimately boils down to budget and features. The tuning will be the same so that shouldn't be a consideration.

Take care.

[travisunderwood]

Originally Posted by Power Hungry

I hope the above answers help. It's often a hard choice to make between the Gryphon and the Phoenix, but ultimately boils down to budget and features. The tuning will be the same so that shouldn't be a consideration.

Take care.

On the computer code issue, should I be worried about the shifting strategy differences you mentioned?

On the 85 tow - will it get the best mileage out of all the tows, since that is the weight range I will be in? I don't think I will ever be over 4000 lbs much less up to 10,000

How about the Fuel-Sipper?

Should I consider having you do a custom tune for the gryphon based on what I have said, or go with one of your stock ones?

Whats turn around on a a Gryphon right now?

If we tweak tunes, you email them to me and I can load them to the Gryphon or do I send it back?

Do you sell any intakes, looking at the S&B but did not see any on your site. I know a lot of people do the Napa DIY - but I rather have a cleaner engineered one.

Thanks for answering all this on the forum. I felt it would be well suited here so others can find the information versus calling/emailing.

[Power Hungry]

Originally Posted by travisunderwood

On the computer code issue, should I be worried about the shifting strategy differences you mentioned?

Generally not. There are just some shifting characteristics that are often less desirable. For example, some calibrations don't lock the converter in 2nd gear or won't lock the converter in 4th at full throttle. It's not a problem, per se, but just an annoyance for some folks.

On the 85 tow - will it get the best mileage out of all the tows, since that is the weight range I will be in? I don't think I will ever be over 4000 lbs much less up to 10,000

If less than 4000#, The 80 Towing would provide the best overall fuel economy. In fact, you would probably just as easily be able to use the 80 Daily Driver as the shift strategy would be better suited for economy and at the load you indicated, it's not a significant strain.

How about the Fuel-Sipper?

No longer offered. Too many complaints of sluggish performance due to the lowered shift strategy.

Should I consider having you do a custom tune for the gryphon based on what I have said, or go with one of your stock ones?

Just like with the Phoenix chips, all stock tunes to some degree are still custom. You still get the first download included with your purchase that gives you a choice from the available calibrations. These are built to the specifications of the vehicle (modified injectors, turbos, or dual HPOP systems will require an additional custom charge).

Whats turn around on a a Gryphon right now?

The Gryphon with canned tunes is usually 24 hours. Custom files (including standard custom files) are 2 to 4 weeks.

If we tweak tunes, you email them to me and I can load them to the Gryphon or do I send it back?

Calibrations are provided on our server to be downloaded using the Pegasus Update Client. (Instruction are here: Pegasus Installation and Update Instructions)

Do you sell any intakes, looking at the S&B but did not see any on your site. I know a lot of people do the Napa DIY - but I rather have a cleaner engineered one.

No, we do not sell any bolt on performance parts. We deal strictly with the electronics performance end of things.

Thanks for answering all this on the forum. I felt it would be well suited here so others can find the information versus calling/emailing.

I appreciate you posting. It does help others who have identical questions but aren't sure what exactly to ask.

Take care.

[travisunderwood]

One last question.

'On the computer code issue, should I be worried about the shifting strategy differences you mentioned?

Generally not. There are just some shifting characteristics that are often less desirable. For example, some calibrations don't lock the converter in 2nd gear or won't lock the converter in 4th at full throttle. It's not a problem, per se, but just an annoyance for some folks"

Excuse my ignorance, what is meant the converter is not locked in 2nd or 4th?

Thanks
Travis

[Power Hungry]

We are referring to the torque converter. Some calibrations will lock the converter clutches under specific conditions, and others won't

[cleatus12r]

Originally Posted by travisunderwood

One last question.

'On the computer code issue, should I be worried about the shifting strategy differences you mentioned?

Generally not. There are just some shifting characteristics that are often less desirable. For example, some calibrations don't lock the converter in 2nd gear or won't lock the converter in 4th at full throttle. It's not a problem, per se, but just an annoyance for some folks"

Excuse my ignorance, what is meant the converter is not locked in 2nd or 4th?

Thanks
Travis

Travis,

To get a little more in depth with this question of yours:

Ford had a ton of different calibrations for the 7.3L powerstrokes. Each progressive code had something changed, be it one characteristic or a dozen. The changes weren't usually something that manual transmission truck owners would notice because there is no transmission shifting strategy required (the driver actually determines how the truck shifts instead of the PCM).

A lot of times, the Ford engineers actually built calibrations that didn't "make sense" to people who like to use and drive their trucks. My favorite example is my brother's truck (which shifts like a lot of other trucks out there) that has an MRT2 PCM code. It will not, under any circumstances, command a torque converter clutch apply in 2nd gear or at any usable speed in 3rd gear. It totally wastes all engine torque until the 3-4 shift at 45-50 MPH at which point it goes from a 3rd/unlocked to a 4th/locked.

Any time the engine loses RPM like that, all boost is lost. Acceleration suffers and it's just really frustrating to drive. A lot of other PCM codes do things like keep the torque converter clutch applied on deceleration but only for 13 seconds (MNM0, NVK2, etc.) or until the brake pedal is depressed (just about every 95-97 truck except TDE1/LKM6). Those don't make much sense either.

I see you have a 99. Is that an early 99 (build date of pre-8/98) or a 99.5 (9/98 or newer)? There are a ton of possibilities for your truck no matter which you have, but there are some pretty substantial differences between the two different model years.

[RMBC Freeride]

Excellent information in this thread. I called Bill several months back with similar questions (and answers). In my case it was Evo/Gryphon vs. FU. I was glad to see it all reviewed and covered so well here for others with the same questions.

I have yet to order from Bill due to funds and because my project has been more involved than I ever imagined. I am currently just running a used Edge Evo I picked up cheap on Craigslist, but anxiously awaiting the funds to get a FU. I will continue to use my evo as a monitor (and probably have Bill convert it to a Gryphon for vanity reasons ).

My calibration code is NQW4 - anyone know if this is generally a good one or a bad one? I know I dont care for how it shifts in stock tune, although i cant tell exactly what its doing or not doing and when (as far as the TC is concerned). With the Evo tunes, the shifting seems slightly better but not as firm nor as "tow-minded" as I'd like it to be.

[cleatus12r]

Originally Posted by RMBC Freeride

My calibration code is NQW4 - anyone know if this is generally a good one or a bad one? I know I dont care for how it shifts in stock tune, although i cant tell exactly what its doing or not doing and when (as far as the TC is concerned). With the Evo tunes, the shifting seems slightly better but not as firm nor as "tow-minded" as I'd like it to be.

The NQW4 is a TNAA5 calibration which means that it is very similar to the VDH3 and VDH4 pickup codes except yours controls a glow plug module due to the 50 state emissions requirements that Excursions had.

There are a lot of good programs available for your truck.

[RMBC Freeride]

Excellent! thanks!