Got it fast, woohoo it's great, but stinky cab!!
 

I am amazed how fast I recieved my Gryphon. I didn't expect it for a while with everything going on. Bill and Corey you guys are the best, you rock.

I do have one concern. I have a Volant CAI, the one with the airbox. I used the tow program and the cab smells like burnt dust, kinda like when you turn on the heat in your house for the 1st time. The drone is also really bad. The tank was about half full of 89 so I pumped her full of 93 and switched to the performance tune and no more smell. It runs great, very little drone and I don't here any pinging. Should I worry about running to lean? If so is there something I can adjust to help? Timing, advance etc? I havn't done anything to the truck besides the CAI and leveling. It's on 05 F150 Lariat screw 4x4 5.4.

:cheesy smile:
Thanks again,
You are the best,
Hope things start getting better and I'm praying for you all.

Are you using custom or canned tunes?
Stinky cab, burnt dust smell? While using tow tune?
These questions need to be answered.

Thought about it some more.
You must be running level 2 canned tow tune?
Don't want to burst your bubble but I would only run level 1 canned tranny only tune.
Eventhough the level 2 canned tow tune is richer I think your 05 is running lean.
Like I said before it probably isn't a good idea to try level 2 or 3 anymore until you get your custom tunes.
JMHO

I agree with 88 -use the Tranny only tune since you have the CAI. And, does the smell go away in the tranny only tune? If you didn't have a drone before the Gryphon, it should go away in Level 1 too.

The thing that's puzzling, is that there's no connection between your cab and the internals of the engine, so there's no way for any "smells" generated by a tune internally to get to you. You DO get air over the heat exchanger in the heater, but usually, all you might smell is a brief whiff of antifreeze (due to seepage), unless there's a real leak.

You wouldn't have mucked around in the engine bay to install the Gryphon, so I'm at a total loss regarding the smell.

- Jack

Hello,

Thanks for the input.

Tunes are canned. I am puzzled also. My next question was gonna be where could the smell be coming from? My guess would be from the engine compartment out to the air intake for the heat/ac. That leads to what is actually causing the smell? Something burning, but what? Odd!

I drove to work this morning with the performance tune and the drone is much better, but not gone and the smell was not nearly as bad, but more noticeable when the drone is present. When I installed the CAI (prior to the Gryphon) the drone, performance & drivability got better over time, but never any smell. I believe the pcm adjusted for drone. The drone was almost gone. Is drone more likely to be caused by a lean or rich condition?

Just food for thought:

If the tow tune is richer why would the smell and drone be worse than the performance tune and stock?

I also know there is disagreement on the CAI here, but my previous experience with intakes on motorcycles leads me to believe in them. It’s not just a matter of maximum airflow at wide open throttle. I used to tune street and race bikes (rice burners) before they were fuel injected and different intake shapes, sizes, configurations all effect performance and drivability.
A little of subject, I know. I will start a new post with my thoughts on the subject when I have more time.

If I sound like an argumentative jerk I don’t mean to. Just looking for input.

Again Thanks a Bunch,
You guys are the best

I don't want to be argumenative either but past occurances have happened on the 04-05's with a CAI and edge/gryphon tuners. Even just running a CAI is already been an issue with some of those year trucks.
We only suggested what we did based those occurances and Bill's past advise also.
Use your CHT in your display.
Record each read out after each tune tried for at least 30 miles at highway speeds.
1. Stock
2. Tow
3. Performance
If the CHT read outs seem to get higher for a certain tune then that tune is running lean. Lean will cause higher engine temps.
Its your truck and you can do to it whatever you like but by posting our concerns for the integrity of the motor we are turning on the caution sign until Bill gets back so he can address your issue.
New motors start at $8K from Ford.

Since you got your tuner now, please update your user cp with you hex code and serial number.

OK will do. Any idea what CHT range is on a completely stock truck?

Any chance someone could chime in on my other questions?

Thanks

Left the Hex written on the install directions on the counter at home. I'll update both when I get home from work. Sorry:(.

I do remember one thing I wrote down last night and that was 0-60 times.
Stock 7.37
Tow 7.24
Performance 7.07!!!!!
Three tenths with canned tunes 0-60. How could anyone be unhappy. Just push a couple of buttons and Zoooommmm.:drool2:

Next, exhaust and Bill's Magic.

Stock CHT should be around 204-208.
My canned tow was about 209-210.
My perf canned tune ran about 213.
My 87 custom perf+tow is about 212.
Anything above 218 (no weight truck only) cruising the highway.

A wide ban AFR meter would really help you to see the AFR. That's what gives you the numbers to see what the tune is doing. But they are $200-$400.

I will admit at first this EFI stuff is a bit confusing but it takes on a whole different way of thinking of how things work compared to carbs. These motors are not push rod style ones either anymore. They are all computer controlled overhead cam types. The motors are based off of Ford's indy platform motor.
BTW nice 0-60 times.

Thanks for the temps. I'll check it out tonight. I'll be on the highway about 20 miles each way to play cards.

Wasn't sure if the times were good. Don't have anything to compare them to. Just wanted to see the difference. The perf time was with the rears spinning (that never happened before!!!) and I let out of the gas to get it to hook up:cheesy smile:.

I'm somewhat familiar with EFI also. Tuned a decent amount of Injected bikes also (closed loop) just stopped tuning not to long after they started injecting them. Started feeling like I imagine Bill does, plus I sold bikes and worked at a bike shop for 15 years. Just didn't want to look at them anymore. Didn't even look at the again for about 10 years. Then about 2 years ago, back on a rice burner. I'm ramling again sorry.

Thanks

Ah, 88 - don't you mean:Yes I did and I editted them

Stock CHT should be around 204-208.
My canned tow was about 209-210.
My perf canned tune ran about 213.
My 87 custom perf+tow is about 212.
Anything above 218 (no weight truck only) cruising the highway.

(Cylinder Head Temps all in the "200s"?) And, those numbers are pretty similar to mine, unless I'm towing up some long steep grade where the transmission is down to 2nd and the RPMs are running near 4000.

- Jack

Haha I was gettin' nervous until I saw that connection because my truck is always within 6˚ of 190˚^
Do you guys think the smell and drone are related in some way? We know that the drone is a harmonic vibration, could it help make something eek out onto the heat exchanger or something like that? Because it sounds like when the drone isn't as strong the smell isn't as strong. And metal is a good conductor of vibrations so they dont have to be physically connected to be affected.

Actually the plastic CAI's tend to drone a lot more than the metal ones do. The plastic tends to resonate a lot easier than metal.
Look at some of the posts where the hemholz silencers were removed on the stock intake. Guess what?, they got drone.
Bill has said in posts in the past that the 3" metal CAI's are easier to tune the drone out.

To the OP,
Was the tow tune the first tune you loaded?
During that first tune load did you open up custom options and put in any adjustments?
Any codes?
There have been a couple of other weird occurances to date when the canned tow tune along with a CAI has been loaded initially with a custom option adjustment.
Usually just reloading the stock tune and then doing a reload of the canned tow tune will clear it up.
That's why I asked.

I did not. Here is what I did do.

Installed Gryphon and loaded tow tune.
Installed stock tune.
I then reinstalled the tow tune with custom options to adjust gearing. It was correct at 3.73 and adjusted the tire size with the calculation chart.
Drove the truck home with tow tune. Smell and drone were present.
When i got home I tuned back to stock.
Downloaded pegasis and updated Gryphon. Both firmware and Calibration. Neither changed they were both the most recent.
Went for a drive and did the stock 0-60 time and drove a little while.
Then tuned to tow and did the 0-60.
Drove about 10 miles and filled up with 93 octane Shell gas. The tank was about half full of 89 octane.
Drove 10 miles back to the same spot and did the 0-60.
Then Just went home and parked it for the night.

Thanks

what are your version numbers for the firmware and calibration?

Ok on the drive home I noticed the smell is worse when the heat is on and even worse when it is on the floor only. When I got home I smelled the floor mats carpet everything, but no smell. When I took my shoes off I smelled the bottoms and eewwww the smell. I think I may have walked thru something. I will drive it tonight WITH DIFFERENT SHOES and post up when I get home.

I feel STUUUPID :cursin:. I was out of work most of last week and only wear my work shoes to work which is where my Gryphon was delivered on Monday. It snowed last week and I wonder if something was put down where I work and I walked thru it on my way into work. I installed the Gryphon during my lunch and smelled it for the first time on my way home :censored1: . If that is it I'm a moron.:shrug:

Thanks for the waisted brain power.

I'll still post my version after I check them.

ahahah!!! thats hilarious!! hopefully youre right and nothing major. :woot:

Jack, I have an 04, K&N CAI, and the gryphon on level 2. my CHT didnt get above 192 all night. Does this mean im running rich? shouldnt i be a perfect candidate for extreme lean conditions?

If they put something down to melt ice that stinks up your truck then you might have a problem when summer comes around. I've smelled what a warm front can do to a bucket of bait....:disbelief: my eyes still water at just the thought.

If this really is the problem, we need to make this a sticky! :smiley_roll1:

Not laughing at you, just laughing with you and I really hope it's this simple.

X2 what he said!
Made me choke on my coke!
Hehehaha!

Bamboo,
Make sure the PID is set to CHT and not ECT. That 192 sounds more like an ECT.
Its not that I don't believe you but just double check it?
Please.

You COULD be a candidate for "lean", but I'm not as sure as 88 is that CHT is really a good indicator. If your load is low (no hills, no high outside temps and no high RPMs, you're not going to see high CHT values. A value of 192 is about what your thermostat is supposed to open at (195 degrees), so it's probably just doing its job. And, Level 2 is a "richer" tune and in gassers, a rich mixture "cools" the engine.

My CHTs tend to stay under 200 (I think) when I'm not towing and just cruising on level ground. If I start climbing, though, they jump to the 210+ region pretty fast. I don't recall seeing anything above 220 though, even on hard tow pulls up mountain passes.

Really though - you WANT the CHT to be in the 195-210 region. This is where the engine operates efficiently and the emissions are lowest.

- Jack

Yup, CHT it is.

Fair enough, I guess I'm just suspicious when my truck is working correctly... that doesn't happen to me very often :doh:

Ok. I'm 90% sure it was the shoes. It's gotta be the shoes.:hehe:. Please feel free to laugh at me. I am deserving and holy :censored1: it's funny. I'm glad it was that easy :rofl:. if it is the shoes. Now I'm gonna have to burn a month old pair of Chaps dress shoes and they were really comfortable, ugh. I'll be wearing a different pair tomorrow so I can be 100% sure. If it is the shoes you guys can pick my avatar. I tried to attach the pictures. Hopefully you can see them. By the way my first name is Donald, so Dumb Donald:shrug:.

Attachment 355

Attachment 356

Attachment 357

The more I think about it the more it makes sense. After the truck is warm I use the dash and floor heat and right about the time I get to the twisty, hilly part of my drive (more on and off the throttle = more drone) I switch the heat to full blast on my feet, my feet are wearing the stinky shoes:smiley_roll1:, So more drone, more smell and my brain says they go together DOH!!!:whatthe:

So anyway the number stuff. Not that it really matters now.

Firmware 3.02.0639
Calibration 1.02.0644
CHT was pretty steady at 202 and fluctuated between 198 and 206. It went up to a max of 214 about 2 miles when I first left work. I suspect the thermostat was blocking coolant till the engine warmed up.
On my way home I drove between 50mph and 60mph for about 20 miles. Then about an hour later on the highway 20 miles to play cards and 20 back at 65mph to 70mph.

Thanks again everyone,
Gary(for some reason I go by my middle name)

Oh. Can someone try to get this to Corey. She might find it funny and I think a little laugh might be a good thing.

I'm just glad it was your shoes and not your motor!
You had me thinking in overtime! I really don't want to go down ths road again.
Now get the Frebreeze out or the Simple Green and start deoderising!

Lean=to much air not enough fuel
Rich=to much fuel not enough air
Lean burning motors often have hotter exhaust gases and that's why holes get put in pistons, valves seals go, pipes blue, exhaust manifolds crack, and more.
Rich burning motors often have fouled plugs, plugged cats, soot deposites in exhaust, and more.


Been subzero to mid 20's up here and my cht's are still in the 200's on the stock tune!
Maybe one of these days I should get that vista thing and try to update to Bill's adjustments that he did for me?

Hello,

IT WAS THE SHOES, FOR SURE!!!!!

I want to thank everyone again for the time and brain power you spent trying to help me and I’m sorry it was a waste of both.

88 racing I am also very happy it was not my engine!!!!

I wish it were easier to pull the spark plugs on these tanks. Then I could see if it’s running lean.

I have just over 50k miles. I saw the TSB last month when I found this forum and I’m terrified about changing my plugs. It’ll be the first thing I do when I break out the Mustang this spring.

I think I’ll change my screen name to STANK FOOT. Any thoughts on the avatar?

Thanks again
Gary

We aren't that way around here about making fun of people.
I'm just glad it was your shoes.

However I'm going to add this to the moderator's trouble shooting tips and the title will be "If Canned Tow Tune is Loaded and If There is a Smell, Make Sure They Check Their SHOES" LOL's
J/K!!!

Gary, we all "owe" you for the laugh. And, not many guys would "fess up" to it. You're a brave man. :thumbs up yellow:

You can just change the "Custom User Title" in your User Profile if you want. You don't really want to change your screenname though, because that would cause you to re-register and, we'd rather not have "two of you". :hehe: (Or two of anyone else for that matter).

You're right about detecting a lean running engine by checking the condition of the plugs though. It would be a good thing to check. I used to ALWAYS do the plugs myself. But, I have no desire to play with these. If they're going to break, I'd rather they break in the dealership's garage.

- Jack

Yeah, we aren't going to do that to ya.
but if your still thinking about the picture...:hehe:

I like the picture and I stole it. I meen borrowed it.


I put the calvin chevy splash screen on last night. It's very cool. My truck actually has power, accelerates and shifts like it should. I wish I would have found this little miracle box a long time ago!!!

I have a bunch more questions to pester everyone with so I'm gonna start a new thread and post them up.

Thanks again everyone
Stank Foot

Rusty (a.k.a. Stank Foot),
Just a thought on the user name. You could go with the American Indian theme and change it to "He who walks in $hit".

Sorry buddy - just had to pile one more on. I'm :giggle: like hell as I write this..

:rofl: Ok, if you want it THAT bad.
Yeah, me and Xperties have been making those just because we think its fun to be different.

:hehe: Should have seen me while I made that picture he is using as his avatar.

You guys are being cruel now! :hehe: Poor old "Stinky Foot" is NEVER going to live this down with you on his case all the time. ;)

Could have been worse! Could have been some "dog poo"! :throwup:

- Jack

If the cab stinks. Check your shoes!!!!!

Quote made famous by none other than.....

STANK FOOT!!!!!

Try having 25+ cats around.

Btw, my CHT is always 199-203 I am in a 06 with a CAI and running level 2 with +2 timing.

My best 0-60 is like 9.15 seconds on the tow tune.

My Gryphon makes my truck smell like dog poo

........wait never mind



:hehe: