Install Success
 

Got the Gryphon installed and successfully on Level 2 w/ no issues until my custom tune arrives. thanks to all for the help, especially 88Racing :woot:

The only other help I need is to determine if I can go ahead and set my GR and TS. I bypassed the custom options during initial setup. Can I go ahead in and change things now or do I need to drive on it for awhile. the manual reads as if you don't have to wait.

Congrats on your success!:)

In the near future page 14 of the manual will include the following new paragraph.

" If this is your first programming session with canned or custom calibrations, choose NO to bypass this option to insure that custom files are built from valid data in the PCM. Simply opening the Custom Options menu in the first programming session may cause invalid data to be placed in custom files."

So drive the truck around for approx 100 miles then proceed with the tire and gear sizes.

Once again thanx for your keen eye to correct some things that were overlooked.

Enjoy!

Thanks 88...you've been a great help throughout this whole process. I'll be in touch.

I have one additional question...hopefully someone sees this. Is it normal when installing the pod to have to force the right side (when looking at it) down in between the two sections of dash.....in my case, b/w the dark gray panel where the vent is located and the brown leather panel to the right. My pod would not sit flus on the dash unless I made sure the right side was b/w the 2 panels and pushed down to make everything fit flush and tight. When I did this, it caused the 2 dash panels to spread (just slightly), causing a larger gap than normal.

I don't see this as a big deal but am wondering if my pod is not fitting right for some reason. I've seen instructional pics that don't look like any "spreading" was required to get it to sit flush. Any guidance is appreciated.

It did that with mine also.
It pinches it to hold it.
Nothing to worry about.
But
If its really lose then that's when that "L" piece is used.

BigSur - I didn't notice any "spreading", as you put it, but you DO have to push the right side down so that the pod "snaps" on. This actually holds it in place very securely, which I see as a good thing.

Regarding using the custom options menu - I've spent a lot of time with this thing. I do not see any problem using it to set your TS and GR immediately after completing the first programming session without it. However, I'd be much more cautious about changing other parameters, especially if you have custom tunes. For this, I strongly recommend driving the truck "as is" for a while to figure out what it is that you need to change (if anything at all). Then, make sure you understand what it is you're changing!

To minimize confusing interactions, try to work with one thing at a time and TEST. And, resist the tendency to make big changes.

Remember, your tunes were written by a "pro". If you modify them, you ought to have a pretty good reason. I get very impatient with people who want to know, "How to make Bill's tunes better". :shrug:

And, please don't hear me making any accusing statements toward you here. I just feel it's good to bring these points up again since the subject comes up so often. I suspect you've done it, but if not, please read through the Q&A on Custom Options to get a better idea of what's going on.

- Jack

No, I don't take that wrong at all. That's a very good point. My plan is to correct TS and GR for my canned Level 2...and that's it. I personally have no desire whatsoever to start playing with parameters. Bill is the Engineer; I'll let him control that aspect.

I'm only having one issue that this programmer might help me with, which started well before I installed it. When I go from first to second gear, it seems to be a very hard shift, especially if I'm going really light on the accelerator. In May, I towed my camper down to NC, and I noticed that a couple of times when shifting from 1 to 2, I would physically "feel" a "bump" coming from the rear end. I haven't felt this much or at all since I've been home and not towing, but it still seems to shift hard at the low gear unless I'm into the pedal a little bit, i.e. shifting at higher RPMs.

Do you think this is normal or anything to be worried about? I'm wondering if I should have my transmission checked out. What do you think? I was actually going to post this in the transmission forum at F150 but you prompted me.

It's fine to bring it up here, but the guys at f150online might have some ideas too.

It COULD be that your Torque Converter is locking too soon or is locked as you do the 1-2 upshift. This is one of the things you can monitor on the Gryphon and CS/CTS platforms. If you see a little "padlock" symbol next to the "Commanded" gear number, the TC is locked. That would tend to make the shift feel harder. The TC lock point is governed by both speed and power demand, so if the power demand is low, it may be locking prematurely.

I've felt what you describe at times pulling up a "mild" hill with a trailer and the TC locks in 3rd. Then, when it upshifts to 4th, it does so without unlocking and the shift is quite "harsh". I've also felt something like this at times when at a lower speed where I've come off the gas and then I step down on the pedal again, but not too hard - it feels like the transmission abruptly drops into a lower gear and there's a hard "clunk" and "lurch".

In Custom Options, you can delay the TC locking for any of the gears, by ADDING to the "zero" value that you'll see there. You can change it +/-2 in 1st, +/-3 in 2nd, +/-5 in 3rd and +/-10 in 4th I think. If you put in negative values, it causes the TC to lock sooner and stay locked longer as speed decreases. You can also adjust the part throttle up/downshifts the same way.

You might try playing with those settings. I've cranked my TC lock/unlock and part throttle up/downshift as far negative as they'll go on my non-towing tune, because I want the engine at the lowest possible RPM for cruising. The WOT power is still there though.

This is an example of what I was talking about when I said to drive it a while to see if there's anything you DON'T like. If you were to decrease your upshift/downshift 1-2 settings and increase the TC lock/unlock settings for 1st and possibly 2nd gear, it might eliminate what you are feeling.

- Jack

Very good info Jack, thank you. I'll probably have to read what you've wrote 2 or 3 times to fully understand before I would feel even remotely comfortable with adjusting settings. However, your description almost hits dead on b/c I too have noticed the thump when letting off the pedal and then stepping back into it at the wrong time or close to a shift. In short, I think I'm shifting too soon from 1 to 2. I'd like to increase the speed and/or rpms slightly before that shift occurs, as it always shifts better when under those conditions.

I will research this more and will most likely utilize your advice and play with the subject settings once comfortable. Thanks again.

On a side note.

Bigsur,
Please update your user cp with the following,

Phone number.
Gryphon serial number.
Hex calibration code.

Nobody else will see this information except PHP and super moderators.

Thank-you

Done.

Jack, I wanted to put this issue back in front at the right post so I have one consistent thread to refer to when I plan to adjust my settings.

SO, to clarify...I understand that delaying the TC locking in 1st or 2nd may help by adding to the zero. In the last sentence of your post, exactly which setting would I play with to "decrease your upshift/downshift 1-2 settings"? I'm not sure I'm clear on this change, i.e. what I'm changing and to what capacity. Thanks for clarifying if you don't mind.

Also, what display should I be viewing to monitor the TC? I'm heading out a little later to start playing around with this. Want to make sure I'm prepared and know what the heck I'm doing. Much appreciated.

And just to add one more note to this, I've also noticed that the truck seems to be doing this more when it's hot and I've been running it for awhile. Yesterday, it was doing it repeatedly after climbing some hills and after a 180 mile drive. I've let the truck sit overnight and just took it for a drive. Not doing it now. What is a typical transmission coolant temp after running for awhile? I was in the 170's last night driving up here.

What have been your ambient temps?>>Or what's the weather like in the area you've been driving in?

For example the last few times the garage queen has been out, its been mid 70s to lower 80s. Driving her at approximately 80 mph with varying elevation of 500ft. The tft average was 154 over a 60 mile trip.
My CHT was 208-210.

The comm gear pid is the one to view for tc lockup.
It will show what gear your tranny is using and a paddlelock as a symbol for the torque convertor lockup.

THanks 88!!! Ambient temps where I'm at have been in the 90's to low 100s this past week. My TFT is usually around 156 but will increase to 175+ at times. If my assumption is correct....the more I think about it....the shifting seems to be an issue when the truck is really hot ONLY. I'm realizing that its amost never repeatable when the truck has been sitting. Might take some more research.

I really don't know the overall condition or maintenance of your truck to speculate anymore.
And......
I never recorded the temps last year when I was driving in 100+ weather.

Maybe its time for a pan drop and change the filter and add some new fluid?

Some others have done a flush. But don't get the flush done with the chemical additives.

Just some thoughts.

Here's generic tables I found on fluid temps vs. break down of fluid over miles driven.
http://www.txchange.com/heatchrt.jpg
http://www.mag-hytec.com/images/chart.gif

Thanks again. I've had other recommendations for a flush, so I think I'm getting that done regardless. Appreciate the charts man...good reference to have.

And as a follow up, for those who are following this.....I placed the "comm gear" in the display to monitor the TC. It is only locking when in O/D...that's it. Not sure if that's good or not.

It's fairly normal to see the lock only in O/D, BigSur (sorry I'm late getting back to you but we took the trailer off camping up on Mt Graham and there's no internet, or anything else, including potable water, where we were). There IS a beautiful mountain stream though.

If you lock out the O/D, I'm sure you'll see the TC lock up in third. When I'm pulling my trailer up the mountain, I usually put the transmission into 2nd gear, to keep it from shifting so much. The TC will lock up in 2nd too, when the loading is right.

The shifts I was talking about are the "Part Throttle 1-2, 2-3 and 3-4 upsift/downshifts". They're in the custom options menu, I think next to the TC lock/unlock choice. These only effect when shifting occurs in "normal driving", when you accelerate like average traffic in town. The WOT shifting behavior is completely separate from this.

Part throttle shifting is governed by speed and by throttle position. If you increase the throttle, up and down shifting occurs at higher speeds. With a positive adjustment, up and down shifting would occur at an even higher speed at a given throttle position.

- Jack

Thanks for clarifying. I might give that a try. The truck has only done this once since my May camping trip, and that was over this past weekend when starting up a hill. I went a spoke with my mechanic yesterday (Ford specific), and he stated that I shouldn't have any worry of damaging anything and that it would be hard for them to diagnose the problem if it can't be repeated. With that said, I think I'm going to wait for my custom tune, load it, and see how it drives. I'll either need to make changes all the way around or hopefully just to the tow tune.

Hope you had a good time on your trip. Sounds fun.

Just a quick note to add to 88's great graphs on transmission temps and longevity - About three weeks ago we took a trip with the trailer up north to Mesa Verde, CO. The interstate north of Phoenix drops down into the Verde Valley and then climbs (and climbs) back out. The outside temperature on that trip was about 104 degrees, and I was in 2nd gear on the incline at between 60-65 mph. My TFT reached 225 degrees briefly in that pull. When on the flat though, it stayed more in the 170 degrees region.

Pulling the trailer up Mt Graham last week (about a 7000 ft climb), the TFT only got to about 208 degrees. The outside temperature was in the nineties (dropping as we climbed) and because of the VERY twisty road, our speed was about 25-30 mph, again, in 2nd gear.

So, towing does heat up things, but not unduly unless you are doing a lot of uphill pulls in hot weather. In my case, the "average" temperature stays in the "safe" zone.

- Jack

My apologies...I do have one more follow-up question. SO, since I'm not noticing any premature TC locking in 1st or 2nd gear, I will probably leave this setting alone. That leaves me to the part throttle adjustment. Your recommendation is to scale it back a little, hence causing the truck to shift a little earlier, correct? Being that this is for my tow tune, would I want to do that? Wouldn't I want to shift at higher RPM's when towing?

Again, hopefully my 87 perf tune will run better and I won't have to adjust much but I might as well get my Level 2 in good working order now...while I'm running it. Thanks again Jack. Can't say enough how much I appreciate all the help.

You're right, I probably confused things a bit in my last post, since I did not go back a reread the entire thread. Yes, I said to REDUCE the part throttle up/downshift points (negative values). I wanted to get the truck into higher gear sooner to reduce what you felt was a hard 1-2 upshift. (I was thinking there would be slightly less torque being applied at an earlier shift point).

You can only change this value for 1-2 and 2-1 by +/- 2, so the change is not going to be great. I doubt it will hurt anything even when towing. Bill has said he feels the truck is geared too low in 1st anyway. I agree. I just want it in 1st long enough to start moving, then I want it in 2nd.

I think I'd still INCREASE the TC lockup/unlock points for 1st and 2nd gears though. You COULD be getting such a momentary lockup that it doesn't register on the Gryphon.

- Jack

I'll do this sometime soon and will follow up to let you know how it does. Talk to you later.