Underdrive Pulleys
 

Picked up a set of underdrive pulleys last weekend, probably going to install them this weekend. Planning to take photos throughout the install. I'm excited!

Great man...:thumbs up yellow: Definately keep us posted on this..I've been looking for them myself. Where did you get yours? I'm curious about power gains..

Cool! Did ya get 'em from Troyer?

Waiting for the ones I ordered from Troyer also. Should be here early next week!:2thumbs:

Be great to see pictures.

Lars
:cool_beans:

I have the Troyers. You can feel the difference. I have FAL e-fans also so there is alot less spinning around.

Didn't go with Troyer's set, picked up a set from Summit Racing, saved about $100. Hopefully it's not a "get what you pay for" situation. My buddy put theirs in his 71 Mustang, he's driven it hard for about a year with no problems. Hopefully I'll find the same results.

I'm dying to get a set of eFans put in, just can't decide if I want to build my own kit or buy one. Troyer's asking about $425 for their set, can piece one together for around $200. Anyone have any suggestions?

What was the part number from Summit? I'm thinking of keeping a set or two in stock for customers.

Make sure You check the application on the bottom of the Summit description. I don't think they have any that will work on the '04-'08 5.4l F-150. I looked into this before, Thats why I own the Troyers.

Good thing I don't have 5.4L :)

But there's no good news either they sold me the wrong :censored1: kit anyway. So, I gotta put the whole damn thing back together with the factory pulleys and send this one back so they'll send me a good one back. :throwup:

Still want that part number Bill? :lol:

Ummm... I guess not. :crazy:

If they send the correct kit I'll lettou know the part number!

I've read some stuff about underdrive pulleys not turning your alternator enough. Would anyone suggest bumping up my idle on the Gryphon?

That's the usual procedure, since underdrive pulleys turn things more slowly. But, unless you do a lot of idling with a heavy electrical load, you may not have to change the idle speed. I imagine, with a Gryphon, you could simply monitor your charging voltage to see if there's really any reason to adjust the idle.

It might really be needed if you coupled the pulleys with e-fans, since they add to your electrical load.

- Jack

Yeah, efans are in the works. Especially now that Summit is sending me a $140 gift certificate for my troubles. Still lingering between building my own kit or buying one. Just can't justify Troyer's $425 set, Flex-a-lite is right up there in price too.

Hey Dixie Design

Read Troyer spec on his efans and under drives. I think it said 130 amp min altenator w/ efans and underdrives. The FAL efans I priced were about $175 more than Troyers @ Jegs. Just my opinion also is that Troyers look safer, they have a grill shroud on them.

Lars

Edit: Troyer specs that his efans will work even if you don't have the optional 130 amp alt and are running UD pulleys

yeah, I really like everything I've read and heard about Troyer's efans. Just a lot of money to spend after everything else I've done lately. Just need to quote my next customer enough to cover the efans :hehe:

Hey Dixie

The kid called me and said they came in the mail today. Probably be this weekend or the next before I get them on. I will keep you posted.

Lars

You talking UD Pulleys or eFans? I'm checking the forum on my cellphone and might have missed something.

The pulleys
Sorry about that.

Lars
:cool_beans:

Here is some UD pulleys that I found. I'm not sure how good they are but they're cheap.

http://www.rpmoutlet.com/f150asp.htm

Also found these but let me know what you decide or if anyone knows more than I do....let me rephrase since everyone knows more about these than I do. I know they all reduce drag on the serpentine belt but I have no idea which ones are better. heres this:

http://www.car-stuff.com/fordpulleys.htm

That's interesting that they are listed for '97 to '06 when most other pulleys stop at '03. :confused: Maybe they are the same. :shrug:

I think I'll wait for someone else to give 'em a spin before I throw a set on the Expy. :D

I thought it was strange too. I thought it would stop at 04' as well when they made their last major changes to the f-150 but both of those sets are far cheaper than anyone has been talking about. They may be crap but for the job they do, I can't see how one is better than the other besides the material or the diameter of the pulley. We'll see from someone else though I'm sure.

Either stay with performance shop recomendations or someone else who has ordered them. A lot of the warehouse internet companies probably have never seen, used or heard of the product. They just see numbers on a screens. Pay attention when ordering or researching.
Just an opinion from a guy who hates returning screw up from someone elses keystroke errors.
Read
Read
Read
Research
Research
Research
Evaluate

Lars

Those don't look too bad. Of course I like the nice shiny ones that Summit sells a little more :) That link you posted had a misrepresentation too, says they

My Summit kit came with the paperwork and decal for SFI Approval.

Judging from the web address you sent for that page: f150asp.htm, would lead me to think that they were ASP pulleys, same manufacturer that Troyer uses. May or may not be the exact same kit. I also usually try to do a little digging, especially with part of my business being web design/programming I almost always check the company's website. Would leave me a little leary with a company who has virtually no website, just a splash page http://www.motoblue.com

Not trying to dog those pulleys, heck they might be better than Summit's just offering my humble opinion. :cheesy smile:

Ya I was just diggin' around on the net the other night and that's what I found. like I said it would be nice to hear from someone who has actually used them......or I'll be a pioneer and let everyone know

I was also going to ask if you knew why the ones from carstuff are so cheap?

I think they(carsuff) might be imports and/or poor quality metal and/or seconds(might not meet specs). As for rpm outlet do a search for them on the better business bureau, mustang forums, and ford truck forums. Thats just my opinion in a post, take it or leave it.

Lars

well for RPM Outlet, I can say they have the worst customer service in the world. It took me two days to get a hold of anyone, then they can't tell me where my CAI is becasue it was shipped from the warehouse. Oh well you live and learn.

Just to let you guys know. From my research that there are differences between the 96.5-04h and the 04-08. Like everyone knows they went from a 2v to a 3v head and they also changed the water pump housing. This is the big deal when looking @ or ordering ud pulleys.

Lars

They also used a 8 rib belt I believe until '03, After that it went to a 6 rib belt. If You read Troyers description it kinda explains what to look for. I know with the Troyer pulleys, You have to run a 1" shorter serp belt.

RZDANO

How do you like the troyer ud pulleys? Any improvements?

Lars

Honestly, I am very impressed. You can feel the difference right off of idle, The motor revs quicker and throttle response feels more crisp. The only complaint I have is My headlamps are slightly dim at idle, but My idle is at about 500 rpm.(easily changed with the Gryphon) If idle is in the 600-625 range all is good. I watch my voltage on My Gryphon and it never goes under 13V even when the efans are on at idle. I have a pic of them on My first post in this thread.

Mine are still sitting in the box right next to the gryphon box. So maybe Friday I will get a chance to put them on.

Lars
:cool_beans:

Lars,

We're gonna have to get you to come down here just to get all your performance stuff installed. I don't know how you do it, letting that stuff sit in the corner like that! I'd be like... :3gears:

Well guys I know there is no excuse. But I try to put the kids first since I am gone late or on the road for my job. I just don't want to miss anything that they are doing.

Lars

Well Summit FINALLY got me my correct set of UD Pulley's, came UPS yesterday. However they sent me the wrong Serpentine belt...AGAIN.

Talked them into overnighting me the correct one at no charge, should be installing Saturday morning if all goes well and I kick this flu.

Bill, I'll get you that Product # when I get back to the house. The kit from summit is $134 +tax

I know, Lars... Just bustin' your chops a bit. :D I hate missing time with the kids, too. They are only small once.

Thanks for the info, Neal. I can't wait. I doubt I'd stock 'em but at least I'll know where to point folks now. :2thumbs:

Wheres a good place to buy UDP for decent amount?

Apparently Summit. Check two posts up. :)

If nothing else, Troyer Performance has 'em.

I would recomend Troyer he seems to have his act together along with the descriptions.

Let's just see if Neals work for him. Then summit would the better of the two as far as pricing goes.

Lars

Dixie,
I called Summit and told them i have a 06 4.6 2v and they let me know they didn't have a single UD kit to install on my 2v. I looked online and the part for my truck is "sum-c2512" in the notes is has "fits 3 valve engine only" is this the same kit you got?? Or does anyone know if this WILL fit my truck?? If it does i will have them installed next week :). Let me know Price is 134.95 on the webpage

That's the kit they gave me for my 04, SUM-C2512. You'll notice they don't have anything listed for the new body style 04's just the old ones. Here's hoping!

Guess I'll know this weekend!

perfect well if you get yours installed and everything works let me know so i can order them as well. TY!!!

I was looking last night and maybe i was to tired and didnt see them but do they have them for the 5.4? I only saw 4.6.

I didnt see any for the 5.4L either?

Got them on! Was pretty impressed at the ease of the install once I got the correct kit for Summit. They STILL sent me the wrong belt, but I'm driving up to Duluth tomorrow, going to stop by with my collection of belts they've sent and give them an earfull.

Right off the bat I can't say I really "feel" the difference. My idle RPM's dropped about 125rpm's so I know it's working. Will be anxious to see how it effects fuel economy. I've given up on 0-60 and 1/4 mile times, tires are too expensive, lol.

the stock belt does work with this kit correct dixie??? also what belt did you order??:2thumbs:

I know I am not Dixie but most ud pulley kits use shorter belts. Anywheres from 1/2 inch to 1 1/2 inch pending on the kit used. The troyer kit for the 5.4 requires a 1 inch shorter belt.

Lars
:thumbs up yellow:

Summit's kit works with a stock length belt. I'll get the Goodyear Gatorback part number tonight for you if you'd like, but it's the 100.5" belt I believe. Goodyear's site has a part cross reference tool, just matched it up with the Motorcraft part number.

Really, 4.6 still takes the stock size belt.

Just for curiousity what pulleys are swapped out?

The 5.4 swaps the crank and the waterpump, with new resized ones.

Lars

Summit's kit for the 4.6L 04 New body style and up replaces the same, crank & waterpump. The Crank was definitely bigger than stock. Their kit for the 04 Heritage and older was a 3 pulley set, with a new alternator pulley being the 3rd.

I was surprised it took the stock length belt, I bought the 99" belt first and it would NOT fit. Was half expecting the stock length to slip at WOT shifting like my old belt/pullies did, but it didn't.

Does anyone know what part number is for the 04-08 5.4l UDP on the summit site?

I don't think Summit has a kit for the 5.4's

Yes Neal that suprises me also. Just another ? Where is the belt tensioner indicating mark? I usually mark it if I am working on one that doesn't have them.

Lars

[QUOTE=Dixie Design;5734]Summit's kit for the 4.6L 04 New body style and up replaces the same, crank & waterpump. The Crank was definitely bigger than stock. Their kit for the 04 Heritage and older was a 3 pulley set, with a new alternator pulley being the 3rd.

Are You sure the crank pulley was larger???? That would be an overdrive.:confused:

:hehe: my bad, yeah it's smaller. Forums are "against the rules" at my 8-4, was in a hurry. Crank's smaller :)

I was going to ask the same question, when I saw "larger" - didn't make a lot of sense, did it? So, if the alternator pulley isn't swapped, I wonder if the crank is even smaller to give the same effect?

- Jack

I wish I would have measured before I put them on, when I pull my fan out to install Troyer's efans, I'll snap some extra photos and take some diameters for y'all.

I'll post the photos I took after the install tonight.

As promised, here are a couple pics I took after the install. I'll upload some more when I get that big ol fan out of the way :)

The waterpump pulley is the one closer, the crank pulley is the pretty shiney one.

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a3...0/CIMG1670.jpg

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a3...0/CIMG1671.jpg

And no I haven't put the Gatorback Belt on yet, just got the replacement this weekend after Summit sent me the wrong one for the 3rd time.

well i got my Summit UD pulley kit installed this weekend!! I took some pics of the pulleys next to the stock ones and when i go to post this i see i took a pic of the wrong side of the pulley!!!. The install went smooth until i went to start the truck with the stock belt on, I should have looked at the belt tension before i started up the truck and i would have seen it was bottomed out. I went to the parts store and got a 1 inch shorter belt and vualaa install complete. It was around 90 deg outside as i live in south Texas, pulled a trailer with 4 6x8 ft deer blinds with my truck on the canned tow tune and it never went above 196 deg (2hr drive). I let my truck idle for about 20 min at times cruzing around the ranch and it never got above 196 deg. As far as the charging system I have a red top batt. DVD screens/ 2 12inch subs/ 3 sets of HID's/tuner/ and Sirius radio all running at the same time and had no problems with the volt going to low it went down to about 13.6 but would go between that and 13.9 once i hit the gas it goes up to the normal 14.3 14.2 I set my idle speed +70. I think it was on here the MAD doc said that it would help to bump up the idle. Anyhow sorry for the long post I just wanted to let everyone know this has not been a bad upgrade for me so far!!!

http://dygytalworld.ehost-services13...&pictureid=266

Sweet, glad you got it installed! Still loving my set!

Sweet, another set put on. I assume it was a 4.6?

About the belt tensioner I wonder if Neal took a look to see where his is with the stock belt?

Lars

thanks for the sweet deal!!!:happy-dancing:

Great! Good review of the "pros" of the pulley set. Don't see any "cons" at all, do we?

Kinda makes you wonder why Ford didn't design it that way to begin with? :confused:

- Jack

Ford engineers probably had a reason?

Like the spark plugs(another thread)

Lars

Friday morning "tried" to install my set and HOLY $H!T that fan to water pump nut was tight! Yes I was trying loosen it. This next Friday going to have a tech give it his best to get it off. Not unless anyone else has any ideas?

Lars

I was using a 24" cresent on the fan nut with a 20" chanel lock on the water pump pulley bolts with a visegrip holding it tight.

I've got a metal pipe I put over the wrench and beat the hell out of it with a hammer. Little liquid wrench and eventually got it.

Boy that fan nut what a great brain teaser! I even loosened the water pump pulley thinking that it would slide over the nut. Then I could have grabbed on to the pulley hub flange. "Wrong" the pulley only slid part way. Talked to the tech who is going to do the work on Friday and said they use an air chisle to loosen them.

Lars

I hate it when things are that tight - I'm always worried I'm going to break something. (Or, am I turning it the wrong way? :doh: Is this one of those "Left-Hand" thread applications?)

- Jack

Nope I was loosening it the rightway according to the tech book. Was going to use 2 36" pipe wrenches but both the jaws together were to wide. No i'm trying to be careful to not wreck anything. I just don't like to explain broken things to the wife. Because I get the why were you messing around with it in the first place speech and it goes on from there.

Lars:skeptic:

We have more and more in common EVERY day! :hehe:

Guess What?
 

Finally got them installed.
First impressions:
Normal was 14.2-14.4 volts
Now is 14.1-14.3 volts
Temp really never changed.

Only took the tech and I about 40 minutes.

One thing to anyone. Take the cam positioning sensor plugs off. We nicked the drivers side one taking the shroud out.

Belt fit perfectly!


Lars

Cool, Lars - Looks like you won't have to fiddle with the idle RPM for battery charging (or were those voltage readings at "cruise" RPM)? If so, then at idle with lights and accessories on, you could be at a pretty low charging voltage.

I'll be interested to know if you can "feel" any power increase and if you see any gas mileage increase. Let us know!

- Jack

Ok I will add this with everything normal and at idle now and I turn the parks on or apply brake it drops to 13.7 then come back up in 2 or 3 seconds to 14.2. Turn the headlights on and it goes down to 13.5-13.6 and recovers to 14.1.

Its about 55 today and the cht was at about 201-204 cruising at about 70 mph. Came home and it stayed at 200 sitting for 15 min in the driveway.

And of course you do a mod and either its percipitating or you're sick. Its just down pouring right now. Even w/o customs and running at stock, it felt like it had a little more pep.

Lars

Those numbers all sound fine to me, and I'm sure you think so too. Too bad you don't live down here. It's 96 degrees out, the sun's shining, slight breeze out of the west.... This is pretty much what you get, mods or not! :thumbs up yellow:

- Jack

I thought for $30 it was well worth the tech doing the procedure and having "all" tools available. I paid it eventhough I work there and the owner said I didn't have to. It was pretty slow today due to the rain.

Lars

Heres a pretty good price for the e-fans and udp from troyer.

http://www.f150online.com/forums/gro...-purchase.html

Ok quick ?

What's the min volt needed on these trucks when running?

The only reason I ask is on saturday I was going through a car wash and noticed the voltage dropped to 12.7. Truck was in drive and head lights were on and I was idling out during the "dry" cycle. Rpms? Didn't have this pid on. Cht was at 205.

Lars

12.7 sounds low to me. I think I'm always above 13, even in idle with the lights on. You MAY want to raise your idle a bit - maybe 50 rpms or so?

I don't suppose the car wash got the pulleys and belt wet, so they were slipping? I know on my Honda, this can happen when I go through a deep water puddle.

- Jack