more sputtering
 

I read the other threads on this issue. Mine is an 05 FX4, and it mainly does it at part throttle cruising whether on the highway or on city streets. I also have tried going back to the stock tune, and the problem goes away. There cannot possibly be anything wrong with my truck if the problem goes away with the stock tune. Also, my converter lock up is lock out until around 80 mph so I know it's not that. It feels almost like a dead miss or not getting enough fuel because the truck just noses over and sputters. If I let off and get back in it, it's ok, but it's incredibly annoying. I've tried a few times to call, but can't seem to catch anyone during phone support hours. I'm fully aware that they are busy, but ......

I'm starting to get a little irritated because I asked for an update to my 87 performance custom tune about a month after I got it, and waited almost two months to get the updated tune. Again, I know they're busy, but may be a good time to hire additional staff to support the amount of business they have. I assume I could go back to the edge canned tunes, but I paid extra for the gryphon, plus the cost of the tunes, and I want a product that is much better than the canned tunes, not just slightly better or about the same, but different. I would like Bill or someone to help me work this out so I can be happy that I spent the extra money to get a gryphon.

I'll try to draw their attention to this. Meanwhile, could you please complete ALL the information in your User Profile? This will help them tremendously when they try to adjust your tune(s).

- Jack

Try catching Cody on the chat support. I've had success that way.

Good luck with your issue. My truck just plain doesn't like the performance tune; I had the same issue you do. I've permanently switched back to the canned tow tune, and I'm completely happy with that. Still love the Gryphon. IMO the gains b/w the 87 canned tow and an 87 custom performance are VERY minimal. I actually think I noticed more power when I switched back, but that was becuase the performance tune had been compromised and tweaked over and over again in the attempt to eliminate the sputtering issue.

Either way, they will work with you until you're happy. Good luck.

The 87 Performance tune has been reloaded to Pegasus. Return the truck to stock and connect to Pegasus.

You're getting awful close to stock in your timing curves......it may be time to check and see if you need plugs or coils because the increased cylinder pressures with the advanced timing puts more of an electrical "strain" on those systems.

Thats the thing though. Since there are no data logs or check engine lights, why are you lowering my timing curves closer to stock. I just changed my plugs and this problem was here before and after the plugs, and no CEL before or after. I was under the impression when I paid extra for the gryphon, that I would get a tune that was much more agressive with timing than the edge canned tunes were, at least as much as possible on 87 gas. I would like to have the transmission strategy exactly like the 87 performance edge canned tune, and more timing than the edge canned tune. I loved the way the transmission shifted with the canned 87 performance canned tune. I just wanted the timing curves to be a little more aggressive and the other standard items like rear O2 sensors turned off and speedo corrected, etc. When I got it, my converter was going in and out, so I had you lock that out until a certain speed, but now its killing what little gas mileage I had. I paid the extra money for the gryphon, above the edge, because I wanted a tune that did everything the edge tune did, and more. I don't know what to do next. I'd like someone to call me so I can explain exactly what I'm looking for.

Doug

I'm making you a brand new program as soon as I finish typing this. It will be based on the canned Edge 87 Tow program with your necessary modifications made for your truck. Let me know how it works. I will post here when it's finished.

I realize you did what I asked you to do as far as the converter lock up. I'm just frustrated because I liked the edge canned tune, and I thought wow the gryphon is gonna be better than this? Awesome! Then it wasn't. By the way, I could've sworn mine had three tunes when I recieved it, just like the gryphon. (87 perf, 87 tow & 91 performance) My only concern with using the tow tune, and you might be able to correct it, but Bill was telling me one time that the tow tune had more fuel in it to keep cylinder temps down. When I tried the PHP tow tune, my gas mileage was totally in the toilet. Also, I would like the shifts to be much firmer than the edge tune. Will that have any effect on the rest of the transmission strategy? I hope not. I appreciate the quick responses.

I'm not sure how my last post came across. Talking on the phone and thinking/typing is not a strong suit of mine so it may or may not have been misconstrued as condescending. It wasn't meant to be that way.

Bill will always claim that he is far from perfect and that there is rarely a one-size-fits-all solution to everyone's needs. I am no different (maybe even moreso because I understand how it feels to be in that gray area where things are just "not right") and I'll be the first to admit that I am good at one thing and that is making mistakes.

Obviously, your truck hates our programming as it is. At this point we will have to make special concessions for the truck to get the tunes right (as they are ALL different and react differently to changes).

I can change the stock programming to account for what you've asked for. We will try it. If something isn't working right I will make the time to fix it.

Oh, and the stock Edge and Gryphon come with a transmission only, 87 Tow, and 93 Performance tune.

yep I remember now. You are correct

Does the 87 tow use the same fat fuel tables as your 87 tow tune? If so, is it possible to trim those down to the 87 performance level?
I appreciate the quick responses

Doug

Yes, and I will be making that change.


By the way, how well does the C87 Tow tune you have work or have you run that one yet?

I have run it, but not towing yet. It seemed to do OK, for the short amount of time I drove it. If you don't mind, maybe after we get the performance tune worked out, you could just make the towing changes to that one. Don't do anything to it yet though cause I'm not going to be doing any towing in the next month or so for sure. I'd want to have the tranny strategy and throttle response from the edge, but more timing and much firmer shifts. I appreciate your help.

Doug

Can I step in here for one second?

Cody....is my last tune upgrade "close" to what you've done for stlhrse? In reading this thread, I realize that not only do I have the same issue, but the same goals. For the most part, I LOVE the way the canned 87tow runs.....was just hoping the performance would give me even more "pep". Alot of what you guys are saying here is over my head though :)

I haven't ran my newest tune yet....just wondering if you've made similiar adjustments.

I don't want to step on this thread....I will contact you directly via chat when I get some time. Thanks for taking the time to deal with all this.

Doug,

Try this new custom 87 Perf.

Greg,
We'll see how Doug's works out. He has a very different HEX than you have, but it shouldn't take much to get your kinks worked out.

OK cool. I'll flash it as soon as I get home this evening.


thanks,
Doug

BigSur, I agree. I read your thread the other day before I started this one, and your problems did sound a lot like mine. Hopefully we can get something worked out on mine cause I know how frustrating it can be.

OK, so I flashed the new 87 performance tune, and the tranny strategy felt MUCH better. I then started incrementally increasing timing one degree at a time. I don't know if it was necessary, but everytime I increased timing I flashed back to stock then changed it and reflashed. Anyway, I'm up to 5 degrees of additional timing, and it's running great. I'm not really worried about detonation or anything since it's not on juice or a blower. Although I haven't noticed any performance decreases, I am concerned about the knock sensor pulling timing without me realizing it, if I get some bad gas or something.
Cody, is it possible in your software to disable the functionality of the knock sensor, so it can't pull timing on its own? I use SCT software to tune my racecar, and though its an 02 so it never had a knock sensor, I know that there are quite a few things in there you can just disable. I just don't know if the software you guys use does that, or if it does, if the knock sensor is a switchable value, but it would be nice if it was.
Granted I have only been running it for a few days, but I haven't noticed any sputtering or bucking or anything. It feels really good so far. So, I'll continue running it and we'll see what happens. Maybe by Friday, if there are no problems we can wrap this up.

Thanks
Doug

Disabling the knock sensor is a great way to destroy your engine. If the PCM was pulling timing, it would pull more than necessary. You would not hear "ping" of course, but you would not have the power you want either.

I think if you actually HAVE advanced the timing by 5 degrees, the PCM is compensating.

At this point, I don't know what your goal really is, and I'm not sure PHP does either. You should not have to change the timing in a custom tune.

- Jack

Jack, I am fully aware of what the knock sensor does and how it works. I think Cody understands what I am trying to do, and what my goals are. I've been building engines and doing mechanic work for 20+ years, as well as I'm also a Mechanical Engineer, and a little bit of ping, although certainly not a good thing, is not going to "destroy" my engine. What did performance minded people do before knock sensors, way back in 2002? Or the stone ages way back when when cars had distributors that you actually had to turn to advance the timing......Stop being dramatic, and now I'll politely ask you to keep your opinions to yourself and but out. Custom tunes are not sacred cows. Cody made the comment the other day that he was getting close to stock timing curves on my old tune, so I expected that his timing curve on this new file might be a little conservative. So I upped the timing, and have been very pleased with the results. Let me be clear, you don't need to know what my goal really is. You're not the tuner.

Cory, please let me know if it's possible to lock out the knock sensor's adjustment. By the way, I expect that the timing that is added to the tuner when I modify the tune is a global modifier, that adds 5 degrees to the whole curve, correct?

Thanks,
Doug

OK, this will be my last post.

Doug, I understand exactly what timing does. I have a degree in Aerospace Engineering, about 2 quarters short of an additional degree in Mechanical Engineering (from Georgia Tech) and a Masters in Computer Science. I taught courses in computer programming and embedded systems design for 20 years. I've been playing with cars since the late 50s. I have a TINY bit of knowledge here.

A 5 degree advance in a custom tune sounds like the wrong approach to me. However, I've been wrong in the past and am quite willing to be proven wrong here. I've got no "stake" in this. It's your truck and only YOU know what's really happening with it. I didn't think I was being "dramatic", but I tend to err on the cautious side.

I wish you well. I will only reenter this thread as a Moderator. (And, you are free to post a last word, telling me again to kindly butt out (go to hell?)).

- Jack

I am having the same problem with my truck. My truck does the sputtering with all my custom tunes (87 tow, 87 performance, and 93 performance) but runs perfect on the stock tune and the canned tunes. I'm also thinking about abandoning my custom tunes and reloading the canned tunes. I thought that it was just my truck until I found these threads on PHP's forum. It actually makes me feel better to know that I'm not the only one...

Keep us posted! If Bill finds the cure, sign me up for the antidote!!

Ok. The original poster's problem should be resolved. I will leave this thread open until I find out for sure.

For anyone else that needs their calibrations looked at, please start a new thread as your problem may go unnoticed if you put it here.

To the OP....let us know how things work out and if your issue gets resolved. Good luck and as always, drive safe :)

Then I'll look at yours, Greg. If you want to start another thread, feel free to do so.

Thanks Cody. I'm okay for now. I'll hit you up on the chat when ready. Appreciate your responsiveness. Have a good weekend.

Doug,

I have a couple people waiting on revised tunes. How are yours working out? I want to wait on theirs until I hear back from you so I may not have to go through three or four re-tries for everyone.