Rough running with updated FICM

[eabrust]

Originally Posted by NHRA6002

Well it got so bad and I haven't heard anything from Bill that I had to take the truck into the dealership and have the FICM reflashed by them. Now I have a truck that is ok in stock mode but can't use any other levels in my Evo as the truck will smoke and high EGT's even in level 1. Have talked to edge via email and tried new files from them but no success.
The exhaust note has also changed as it sounds like the variable vane is cycling unlike befor when I would start the truck it would at first sound open and throughty and then close off to a hiss. I wonder if Ford has a new program that is not compatable with the Evo?

Hey NHRA,

did you have your truck put back to stock before you took it in for reflash? Bummer about the tunes not working, but I would guess you need to update your EVO with the Edge fusion software to work with the latest Ford strategy (what is it now, VXCFH9?)

Bummer you sent in your PHP tuned FICM to get put back to stock, but it does prove a point somewhat that the PHP updated FICM has an issue (at least with triggering or keeping inductive heat flash going), where as stock program does not. I haven't been able to prove that out, as I have two FICMs I am swapping between (a stock and a modified), and all I have been able to prove is my bad actor PHP tuned FICM has 48 VDC (hence it seems it is program only, not dying due to power supply or solder joints, etc...)

I am still not running my PHP FICM (for same cold startup issue you had), but am getting closer to hopefully resolving my problem. First, I'm getting my EVO turned into a Gryphon, and following that, what I gather from Bill is that I will then have capability of reprogramming both the FICM and the ECM program via the Gryphon. Second, if I run a custom tune from Bill in the ECM, it will hopefully by default work with the updated FICM program better than the Ford program in the ECM.

I've also been steadily working through the whole 'stiction' issue with these injectors to try to resolve root cause of why it runs like crap cold. Last summer, I was running 15-40 dino oil, my truck would run great on stock FICM & ECM, but putting in the PHP FICM was bad on startup even on 90F days (truck needed warm up time in middle of Summer?...). Put in stock FICM, no problem.... Into winter, I was still running stock, but the truck would run rough for the frist 5+ minutes till EOT came up to ~160F, then it would go good. I got so sick of it needing so much warmup time, that I switched to 5-40 synthetic. That was an improvement, but it still took either some warmup in the driveway, or till engine got to ~120F till it smoothed out and ran good (still about 3-5 miles of driving).

As a side note about my whole injector/crappy startup issue and resolving root cause, about 200 miles ago, I drained 2 qts of the synthetic oil I'm running now (halfway into 5,000 miles service of this change), and added a product that claims to solve the injector stiction issue (I won't name it here yet, I don't want to advertise it, as I haven't had it in there long enough to claim anything as a matter of fact. However, if you do a search via google, you'll most likely find it discussed on most other forums out there, that's how I found it). The only thing I'll say about it is, currently, I hop in the truck, start it and go and it runs fairly well out of the gate with no warmup. I won't claim success until I can either put in the PHP FICM and it runs great cold (would mean injectors aren't sticking anymore even though inductive heat strategy isn't working), or untill truck continues to run great on stock programs after next oil change after this product has been dumped and replaced with all fresh oil. BTW, the product recommends leaving it in for a full 5000 mile change to fully do it's thing of removing oil deposits, etc, so it is definitely to early for me to endorse it at all, but it does seem promising given how my truck runs currently.

regards,
Eric

[NHRA6002]

Yes the truck was put back to stock befor taking it back to the dealer. And yes I have updated the software from Edge 2 or 3 times now as directed by GR at Edge. I have been in contact with Edge trying to remedy this if it is an Edge hardware issue also.
It is frustrating to spend the time and money on a programmer and FICM tuning just to have a stock truck with digital gauges. And now with this latest Ford flash the further worsening fuel milage.

[sonic blue l]

I think you guys need to estabilsh a base line.

To do that you will also need to know what ficm version you had stock. The first inductive heating flash worked well at combating sticktion, however it supposedly causes ficms to fail. (hard to say for certain as i've replaced bad ficms that never had the induction strategy in the first place) Ford then came out with a softer ficm strategy.

Lets say you had a truck that had sticktion so bad it would start and stall, if you updated it with the original ficm inductive heating, it would usually fix the concern. Now lets say you program that truck with the later updated ficm strategy, well now it still starts better then the start/stall, however you will have misfires when cold due to it not combating sticktion aswell as the original inductive heating strategy.

So now if you had the early inductive heating or have a ficm with the original inductive heating and comparing to php ficm with the later inductive heating, then your not comparing apples to apples. Now if your ficm was the later inductive heating and your comparing to the php, now one can do a proper comparison.

BTW personally i feel your truck should run great before you start adding or reprogramming as if it does not, you may just be compounding the problem.

[eabrust]

Originally Posted by sonic blue l

I think you guys need to estabilsh a base line.

To do that you will also need to know what ficm version you had stock. The first inductive heating flash worked well at combating sticktion, however it supposedly causes ficms to fail. (hard to say for certain as i've replaced bad ficms that never had the induction strategy in the first place) Ford then came out with a softer ficm strategy.

Lets say you had a truck that had sticktion so bad it would start and stall, if you updated it with the original ficm inductive heating, it would usually fix the concern. Now lets say you program that truck with the later updated ficm strategy, well now it still starts better then the start/stall, however you will have misfires when cold due to it not combating sticktion aswell as the original inductive heating strategy.

So now if you had the early inductive heating or have a ficm with the original inductive heating and comparing to php ficm with the later inductive heating, then your not comparing apples to apples. Now if your ficm was the later inductive heating and your comparing to the php, now one can do a proper comparison.

BTW personally i feel your truck should run great before you start adding or reprogramming as if it does not, you may just be compounding the problem.

Hi Sonic,

I couldn't agree with you more about knowing what we have and what we're starting with for comparison purposes. I do have a pretty good handle on what configs have been run in my truck, and what works vs what doesn't. I'll run through quick just for documentations sake, maybe it helps figure out the problem some how in the end.?

I'm the second owner of an '06, I bought it last July, so this is my first winter.
Based on the oasis report I pulled after buying it, the truck had never been in the shop for anything engine related... however I can't confirm what ECM and FICM strategies were when I got the truck. About 1 month after I had the truck, one injector died, and after that warranty work, the truck was returned with the VXCF7 ECM and FICM updated per TSB 9-7-11. Truck ran great, and I must say I could tell no difference in power/driveability from the truck I originally bought. During this period in the summer, I was running 15-40 dino oil, and could take off after startup immediately with no problems anytime (no apparent injector stiction issue).

So then I decided I wanted to try the FICM update, I bought a spare FICM, the seller claimed it had latest update in it per TSB 9-7-11 when I bought it. After getting it, I put in my truck and ran it for a full week plus before sending it into PHP. During this time, the truck ran no different than my stock FICM. All seemed good (no apparent stiction issue), off the FICM went to PHP.

Upon return (with PHP tune), in goes the modified FICM, start up and the truck chugs/lopes and smokes like a pig. Mind you, it's still August and the ambient temps are still in the 80s-90s here. Truck ran great with PHP FICM once hot, but I can't sit and wait 10 minutes everyday for the thing to smooth out, and it was obvious that it chugging on startup was dumping fuel and killing my mileage. Is it purely injector stiction, or something else? I don't know, so... Out with the PHP FICM, in goes stock, no problem, runs great. Out with stock, in with PHP, problem is back. I pull the access covers off both, verify both FICMs have 48VDC output. I give up on the PHP FICM for time being and shelve it (to wait for updated software per messages I've had back and forth with Bill).

So now as winter approaches and temps drop, even running stock starts to show some injector stiction/rough start issues (but not anywhere as bad as the PHP FICM was on hot days in summer...). By this time, I have an Edge Evo, I find that running the truck tuned with the Evo level 4 (with stock FICM) makes the truck start worse than with stock ECM strategy (VCXF7 still). So I revert back and pretty much ran stock all winter. I did switch to 5-40 synthetic in mid winter, and notice an improvement in how much warmup time it takes for truck to run smooth, but it wasn't a complete solution, as I still had a few minutes of warmup or about 1-3 miles of driving before the truck would really settle in to running smooth. That's basically where I'm at now.

So I'm still completely stock tuning wise (my EVO is at PHP to turn into a Gryphon), and I'm running the oil additive 'stuff' which is to clean out and solve injector stiction. For all intensive purposes today I can hop in my truck in the morning (30s-40s), and go immeadiately with no real wait or warmup.

I still haven't gotten back to the PHP FICM, perhaps in another week or two assuming truck continues to start great, or upon return of my Gryphon, I'll give it another whirl. However, I still don't have much hope, I have a gut feel that there is something just wrong with the updated FICM program that just isn't working with what ever strategy I had going. NHRA has basically taken the FICM hardware out of the equation, as he reflashed over the PHP tune with a Ford program to solve his problem. I'm confident on my situation also about the hardware end, as I tested voltage and ran the FICM a week before sending off. Seems it is a software glitch of some sort.

Long winded, I know, just trying to layout the facts as I know them in an effort see if others have the same issue (with same strategies?) and to get a positive resolution (ie, updated FICM tune that solves my startup issues). Maybe in the end it takes the Gryphon, with a custom tune by Bill, working in conjuction with his updated FICM software for the truck to run great. If thats the case, great, I can't wait to try it out !! I know for some, the issue is a big problem if they only have one FICM. For me, I'm rotating between a stock and tuned FICM, so I'm not hurting to bad. I'd just love to start using the tuned FICM for all the benefits it is supposed to bring!

NHRA, if you have any of the background knowledge of what strategies you had or have been through during the time you had the PHP FICM (and prior), could you share just for comparison sake?

regards,
eric

[sonic blue l]

well thats a pretty good comparo you have then. If you had switched to vxcf7 then you should have had the later ficm program. I cant quite remember when it came out but the best would be to check it with an ids, or something else that can pull that info to be sure.

If your truck ran fine with stock ficm vs php ficm then it does sound like the php tuning is at fault. What im wondering is how your truck runs with ficm correction disabled on the stock ficm. Thus if it was running how the php ficm does, then one may question if the php ficm drops ficm correction, or has a problem with it.

On a truck with no sticktion and good injectors disabling ficm correction should make minimal to no difference in how the engine runs, thus if some have great results with php ficm and others, not so much. Then perhaps there is an issue with their ficm correction portion or their inductive heating portion.

The thing that i also wonder about your truck is that, i've had my evo on my truck in cold weather -30 c, etc and i never had any problems on the vxcf7. Of course i had my truck plugged in when ever it droped below -15c and i run 5w/40 oil.

I'm actually debating about getting a download for the php ficm, my truck has the vxcf9 currently. I also have a ficm out of a 04 truck that i might put in and try first though. It has no inductive heating, but it may also be so early that it may have pilot injection (not sure if thats in the ficm or not). Just need to find someone who knows how to decipher what ficm cal amz2al09 is.

[NHRA6002]

Thanks Cory

I sent a pm to Bill a few days ago, but have not heard anything so far. I hope we can figure this out as I don't even want to drive the truck the way it is.

[NHRA6002]

Originally Posted by NHRA6002

Thanks Cory

I sent a pm to Bill a few days ago, but have not heard anything so far. I hope we can figure this out as I don't even want to drive the truck the way it is.

Why do I get the feeling of being ignored with the problems I have had with this upgrade, and that I payed for something that has caused more harm/money down the road than good?

[sonic blue l]

Originally Posted by NHRA6002

Yes the truck was put back to stock befor taking it back to the dealer. And yes I have updated the software from Edge 2 or 3 times now as directed by GR at Edge. I have been in contact with Edge trying to remedy this if it is an Edge hardware issue also.
It is frustrating to spend the time and money on a programmer and FICM tuning just to have a stock truck with digital gauges. And now with this latest Ford flash the further worsening fuel milage.

The latest flash should not worsen fuel milage at all, infact the truck should be nicer to drive then the other versions and have increased fuel milage.

My truck had the vxcf5, vxcf7 and now the vxcf9, my truck runs perfect on the vxcf9 and has plenty of power. In fact im just running it stock.

I also have an evo and i updated it for the vxcf9, but i have not installed it yet, so i dont know if i would have any issues like yourself.

How does your truck run stock? If it does not run perfect stock, then you should probably address any of the conerns you may have stock before trying to modify anything.