superchips programmer

dieseldan · #1 Sat, November 21st, 2009, 11:39 PM

this is my first post and first off its nice to be here.

my question is, my 06 superduty with a 6.0 power issues that need addressing. bought the truck new and it had good power, installed a superchips 1706, exhaust and a intake. truck had awesome power, awesome enough to tear the trans out. had it reubuilt, and ford updated the computer. ok well the programmer no longer worked. sent the programmer to super chips and got it back. was never as strong as it once was and the fuel economy was terrible. terrible as in unloaded at 65 mph it averaged 17 mpg where it once before was 20 mpg. well had injector issue a few months back, ford updated the computer again. programmer does not work again.

so should i keep sending the programmer back and having it updated? the fuel economy has dropped again of course since this update. is this programmer any good. it seemed fairly aggressive when it was new

suggestions?

dieseldan · #2 Fri, November 27th, 2009, 01:23 AM

can anyone help?

***Power Hungry*** · #3 Sat, November 28th, 2009, 03:30 AM

Dan,

The problem is not the programmer, the problem is the base calibrations in your truck. Ford continues to hack away at the ECM and FICM strategies until the truck no longer performs properly. The latest round of ECM and FICM strategies has resulted in such a sad state of performance that even a programmer is not able to really help.

At this point, your only solution is to "roll back" your ECM strategy and run a modified FICM strategy. This should not only get you back to where you were, but should also let you programmer function correctly again, providing the power it was designed to make.

Let me know if you need any further information.

eabrust · #4 Wed, December 2nd, 2009, 09:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Power Hungry

Dan,

The problem is not the programmer, the problem is the base calibrations in your truck. Ford continues to hack away at the ECM and FICM strategies until the truck no longer performs properly. The latest round of ECM and FICM strategies has resulted in such a sad state of performance that even a programmer is not able to really help.

At this point, your only solution is to "roll back" your ECM strategy and run a modified FICM strategy. This should not only get you back to where you were, but should also let you programmer function correctly again, providing the power it was designed to make.

Let me know if you need any further information.

Hi Bill!
Can you explain a little more on how the ECM and FICM strategy is or isn't part of the tuning programs for my own understanding? I guess what I'm curious about, is if I get a Gryphon with a custom tune, and I already have a tuned FICM (which still needs some help from you by the way... please please please

), does the custom tune over-ride everything about the Ford strategy in the ECM, or does it just change parts of it and table values? So ultimately, does the level of impact of the FICM and custom tune depend on what strategy the truck has currently (latest Ford stuff being the worst?)?

If it is the case where level of tuning improvements depend on strategy, how does one "roll back" strategies if Ford won't do it? Can you do it somehow, or does one have to go junk yard hunting for old, untouched ECMs?

Thanks for any input, I'm just trying to understand how all this works and what I can expect before I go after further custom tuning. I have installed a plain old Edge Evo, and it helps, but it also affects the truck's cold running symptoms negatively (but not as bad as the updated FICM), and am also curious if that is a strategy based thing or not, or just a general side effect of the tuning and injection maps.

Regards,
eric

***Jeremy*** · #5 Wed, December 2nd, 2009, 09:25 PM

I see ford updated the flashes again...Its VXCF9 now......I can only imagine how bad it is considering how bad VXCF7 was and it was only 3-4 months old.

***cleatus12r*** · #6 Wed, December 2nd, 2009, 11:22 PM

I wonder if there are still any reflash "virgins" out there for the '03 6.0L trucks.......

***Jeremy*** · #7 Thu, December 3rd, 2009, 06:09 PM

I had one at work, that was a virgin, started like you gave it a shot of ether, had a great tow/haul, and the quiet idle. Took it in for the annual safety and emisions, and the damn ford dealer decided to flash it. That was last week.

I was not happy, the only other one I have had its last flash Oct of 03. Still runs like a SOB! Compared to the truck that have been flashed.

***Power Hungry*** · #8 Sat, December 5th, 2009, 01:32 AM

Jeremy,

I'm just about finished with a firmware version that will do a full reflash of the ECM and TCM. This means that you'll be able to go back to the versions that released with the truck with just a simple download.

As for VXCF9 strategies, I'm betting that they have to be better than the VXCF7 because 7 SUCKED! WTF are these calibration engineers doing? All the crap I have to go back and undo.

***Power Hungry*** · #9 Sat, December 5th, 2009, 02:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eabrust

Hi Bill!
Can you explain a little more on how the ECM and FICM strategy is or isn't part of the tuning programs for my own understanding? I guess what I'm curious about, is if I get a Gryphon with a custom tune, and I already have a tuned FICM (which still needs some help from you by the way... please please please

), does the custom tune over-ride everything about the Ford strategy in the ECM, or does it just change parts of it and table values? So ultimately, does the level of impact of the FICM and custom tune depend on what strategy the truck has currently (latest Ford stuff being the worst?)?

If it is the case where level of tuning improvements depend on strategy, how does one "roll back" strategies if Ford won't do it? Can you do it somehow, or does one have to go junk yard hunting for old, untouched ECMs?

Thanks for any input, I'm just trying to understand how all this works and what I can expect before I go after further custom tuning. I have installed a plain old Edge Evo, and it helps, but it also affects the truck's cold running symptoms negatively (but not as bad as the updated FICM), and am also curious if that is a strategy based thing or not, or just a general side effect of the tuning and injection maps.

Regards,
eric

Eric,

Let me break it down for ya...

The ECM and/or FICM can be a limiting factor on performance and economy. Ultimately, the FICM has final say (per se) on what actually goes to the injectors and controls things like Rev Limit, Pulsewidth, and Start of Injection (Timing).

With most engine strategies, the FICM was being updated and becoming increasingly restrictive because very few people new how to reflash the FICM. In these cases, just reflashing the FICM with a modified strategy would result in a very nice low to mid RPM performance gain as well as a nice bump in fuel economy. However, it seem that lately even reflashing the FICM is no longer the only key to a properly performing vehicle.

Lately, the engineers have started to really mess around with the ECM calibrations and the latest group of programs (VXCF7 in this case) have been absolutely horrible. The biggest complaint is severe lack of power, especially when loaded, combined with a sharp drop in fuel economy with some customers complaining their average economy has dropped to around 10 MPG. For a truck that was released in 2003 with average economy ratings in the high teens / low 20's, this is completely unacceptable but Ford continues to deny that there's anything wrong. I guess all their customers are suffering from mass delusion.

My biggest problem with the whole thing is that Ford techs make the change to the vehicle and DON'T NOTIFY THE CUSTOMER! I mean, if you drove in with a 5.4L and Ford decided "Oh, the 5.4L-V8 is a problem so let's replace it with a 4.2L-V6" I think most people (okay, EVERYONE) would be pretty freakin' pissed. Frankly though, that's exactly what they've done to the 6.0L. They've taken the calibration and cut the output down to about 75% (or sometimes less) of what the truck had when it was released... All in the name of curing "drivability" issues. That's crap. All they're trying to do is reduce the number of warranty claims by turning down the power so low that you can't possibly break anything. Screw the performance. Screw the mileage. Screw the customer.

Sorry about the rant, but this is a very sore subject for me and I'm sure it is for anyone who has gone to the dealer for service with a perfectly good running trucks and drove out with a completely different truck.

Anyway, to answer your questions...

1) The programmer currently doesn't completely overwrite the ECM or TCM strategy but instead works with the existing strategy base in the vehicle. Because of this, we've seen problems with the VXCF7 based strategies that aggressive tuning and even FICM replacement couldn't help. However, once the ECM was reflashed back to a VXCF5 based strategy, all was well. The FICM is still a consideration, but if the ECM is so detuned and restrictive then the FICM really doesn't figure into the equation at that point.

2) We currently are able to revert the ECM/TCM back to earlier/original strategies with a simple in-house reflash. I'm finishing up some code that will allow for Gryphon users to be able to completely revert their vehicle back to an earlier strategy without any big hassle at all and expect to have that code available in the next few days. I'm still finishing up the FICM code for the Gryphon as well, but don't have any further release date on that.

3) Certain aspects of the ECM strategy can affect cold running operation, though as you've notice not nearly as bad as the FICM can. The two calibrations do need to work in conjunction to a fair degree, especially when dealing with modified ECM strategies. A more relaxed FICM strategy can offer quite an improvement, but if the ECM strategy contains excessive SOI advance or injection pulsewidth, then the FICM no longer contains it and engine or head gasket failure can result. I generally recommend to avoid ALL extreme performance programs when running a modified FICM until the SOI and PWM tables can be verified to be safe for the application.

I hope this helps.

eabrust · #10 Sat, December 5th, 2009, 06:10 PM

Hi Bill,

Thanks a ton for the lesson, that is the sort of stuff I've been wondering about before I would want to go with any further tuning or programmers. You should 'sticky' that reply, because I'll bet a lot of people have similar questions which may keep them from wanting to upgrade further. I know when I got the FICM tuned, followed by the Evo, and didn't see a huge improvement and it ran crappier in cold weather than stock, I was having second thoughts about considering springing for a Gryphon. Now that I know a lot of issues can be 'undone' , I want to get undoing them!

Bet you can't guess what ECM strategy code I've got.... (VXCF7H3). I'm glad to find out that it is about the worst thing out there on the 6.0s yet, it gives me hope

I still see ~18 mpg on highway, but it sure is sucking in town. Do you suppose that is why I'm having such issues with the modified FICM and Evo? Or do you still think there is a possible code error that prevents inductive heat from starting, or it times out to fast? Either way, once you've got the Gryphon code ready to help fixup the ECM and FICM strategies I'm stuck with, I'm ready to send an order to have you convert my Evo to a gryphon, set me up with tunes, and redo the FICM if need be. I'm excited to get my truck to be fun again!

Thanks again for lesson Bill, you rock

Eric