trans problems with gryphon

fisherman · #1 Fri, May 8th, 2009, 08:13 PM

I've had my gryphon for a couple of weeks now, enjoying it with no problems........ Until this morning. Now the truck makes a weird whining noise and will not shift into 3rd gear. 1-2 is fine, then when its time for third, the tranny slips bigtime. Like it goes into neutral, if you give it gas it just revs up, and sometimes it pounds into a gear with a harsh thud.

Did running my shift firmness at 14 destroy my transmission?? I havent been real hard on it. Just having fun with the new shifting patterns. Btw, I set 1-2 at 5700, 2-3 at 5500, and 3-4 at 5400 all with shift firmness at 14.

***Jackpine*** · #2 Fri, May 8th, 2009, 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fisherman

I've had my gryphon for a couple of weeks now, enjoying it with no problems........ Until this morning. Now the truck makes a weird whining noise and will not shift into 3rd gear. 1-2 is fine, then when its time for third, the tranny slips bigtime. Like it goes into neutral, if you give it gas it just revs up, and sometimes it pounds into a gear with a harsh thud.

Did running my shift firmness at 14 destroy my transmission?? I havent been real hard on it. Just having fun with the new shifting patterns. Btw, I set 1-2 at 5700, 2-3 at 5500, and 3-4 at 5400 all with shift firmness at 14.

First, are you serious with these numbers?

Your torque converter is going to start ballooning at 5400 rpm, according to everything I've read on the subject. To make your transmission shift properly at WOT, you'd need to have your max RPM set to no less than 6100 RPM. This sounds like a recipe for disaster.

And, what engine do you have in your truck? If it's the 5.4L, you are already on the downside of the torque and HP curve at 5000 rpm, why go higher?

Bill has commented on setting the shift firmness too high. The canned tunes in the Gryphon have already firmed up the shifts quite a bit. If you add more to that, you can put serious stress on the drivetrain. Bill has also said that the 3-4 upshift firmness should be quite a bit less than the settings for the other two shifts.

Did you notice the big red warning in the Gryphon manual about making adjustments to these settings in the Custom Options menu?

If I were you, I'd return the tune to stock, immediately! Find out what the truck is doing now. I'd also have a dealer do a thorough inspection and probably a flush of your transmission. You may be in for a rebuild.

If so, it was NOT the fault of the Gryphon!

And, if you're just winding me up to see my reaction, you've seen it!

- Jack

soutthpaw · #3 Fri, May 8th, 2009, 09:08 PM

I gotta agree with Jack on this one. If u think of a manual trans, with a shift firmness of 14. Its like dropping the clutch EVERY time the transmission shifts gear. Too much slip as well as too little are very bad for automatic trannys. Maybe Cody will jump in with his expertise.

SubiGT · #4 Fri, May 8th, 2009, 10:22 PM

Can you post up your VIN so I don't run across your truck on the used lot?

***cleatus12r*** · #5 Fri, May 8th, 2009, 10:51 PM

I see you have a 2006 with a 5.4L.

Well, for 3rd gear, the only different apply component for 3rd gear operation is the direct clutch. It is used in 3rd and 4th gears. You mention a "whining" sound. This can be either stripped splines on the friction elements or a possible unseating of the snap ring that holds the frictions in the drum.

Either way, a flush WILL NOT fix it. It is broken.

The problem with a transmission that shifts too quickly is that hard parts (like splines and one way clutches) really pay for it. The friction elements really love quick shifts. Like DJ said, it's a real trade off for shift feel vs. longevity.

There is a VERY GOOD possiblity that over-running certain apply components during a shift (and shifting really quickly) caused a reversal of rotation that was just too much for a mechanical part to sustain too many times. I see it a lot with forward sprags in 4L60E transmissions when people "rock" their vehicles when stuck or shifting to drive while still rolling backwards out of a parking spot or driveway.

In any case, I think you have exceeded the mechanical limits of your transmission by high RPM full load shifts with too much TV pressure.

Sorry.

twintips_17 · #6 Sat, May 9th, 2009, 02:15 AM

I was just reading this thread and i was curios on what the gryphons shift firmness in for the canned and unaltered tunes was for the tow and the performance tunes?

Anyone???

***Jackpine*** · #7 Sat, May 9th, 2009, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by twintips_17

I was just reading this thread and i was curios on what the gryphons shift firmness in for the canned and unaltered tunes was for the tow and the performance tunes?

Anyone???

Your question has no easy answer, because there are really three components to shifting. Bill talked about two of them in detail here: http://dygytalworld.ehost-services13...40&postcount=2

The third component, that he called "slip" is the "Shift Firmness" component and it's simply the time delay between clutch release and clutch engagement during a shift. The Custom Options menu lets you adjust this as a percentage change to what already is in place for that shift - the "zero" point. So, if the built in "zero point" delay for a shift was 450 milliseconds, then +14 would reduce it to 387 milliseconds.

Both the canned and custom tunes have already decreased the delay that was built in to the stock shifts. And, they have altered the torque reduction and line pressures.

I personally feel that unless you are an expert transmission engineer, you should approach altering "Shift Firmness" with a bit of respect. We have to trust that Bill knows what he's doing and we'd better have a very good reason to undo anything he's set up.

However, I was more concerned about the WOT shift points in the OP's post than the Firmness settings. To get the transmission to complete the shift, he'd need the MAX rpm set WAY up! While we don't have a specific "redline" engine speed on these trucks, pushing it about 1000 above stock seems somewhat excessive.

- Jack

fisherman · #8 Sat, May 9th, 2009, 04:32 PM

This is fisherman's wife. What does a new transmission cost? Hopefully not the marriage!!! lol Seriously though will a new transmission really affect selling the truck in the future? And are we talking hunderds here, or thousands....Arrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrg

***Jackpine*** · #9 Sat, May 9th, 2009, 07:02 PM

Since I've never replaced a transmission, I don't know what the cost is to rebuild or replace. A CarFax report would point up a transmission replacement/rebuild, so, that might effect resale price. If it's not done properly, the thing fails again, usually quite quickly.

There ARE replacements that are more durable than the stock transmission, if you have to go this route.

- Jack

soutthpaw · #10 Sat, May 9th, 2009, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fisherman

This is fisherman's wife. What does a new transmission cost? Hopefully not the marriage!!! lol Seriously though will a new transmission really affect selling the truck in the future? And are we talking hunderds here, or thousands....Arrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrg

I would be surprised if you can get it rebuilt or replaced for under $2500 if you are having someone do the work... I have no idea what a rebuild costs on that truck... as for resale a good upgraded transmission WILL definitely add to the resale value.. go over to http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/forum24/ or go to F150online and ask about transmission recommendations.... you can also probably find a good mechanic on the forums in your area that is willing to do side jobs and save you some cash...
I am guessing the Fisherman is not that mechanically inclined but if you remove the transmission yourself and take it in for a rebuild that can save you lots of cash too...